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Benefits of trapping?

BHC

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Wayne Co. , Tennessee
How impactful can mild- moderate trapping efforts have on a deer herd?
On our property 3300 acres, if we removed 10 yotes trapping and say 5 to gun in a yr, so 15 yotes. To me that could have a huge impact.. If half of those were females, 7, that could be a minimum of 40+ pups not born/ have to be fed the next spring..

What are the facts out there on the subject? Fawn recruitment? Total herd numbers? Reduction in daily stress?

This is mainly Forrestland. 3300 acres of pines, clear cuts, and hardwood bottoms...
 
I've been told by coyote experts that a lot depends on which coyote you remove. They supposedly have some pretty strict "social order" that if memory serves me correct is controlled by an "alpha" female. As long as she is in control, the actual yote population may be surpressed. If you kill her, it may allow an increased number of yotes to expand into that range until another alpha animal emerges and the population goes back down. You actually end up with increasing your yote population.

Make sure you shoot the right one!
 
BHC said:
That sounds impossible to know...

Pretty much so.

It is one of the reasons coyote control is so difficult. You can go back 20-30 years and read about the "coyote wars" they had out west trying to reduce populations for the ranchers to see how difficult it is. The governments have spent major dollars with government trappers and killers trying to reduce yote populations, and are still fighting the battles.

I'm certainly not saying it is a bad idea, but it is something you may not see a big bang for your bucks in doing.
 
From what I have read smstone22 is correct. Coyotes are in summer home ranges from early spring until fall.. Those are the coyotes that work on your fawns and poults the most.. So trapping from feb-bow season may be the most effective.. Most surveys I've seen saw an increase in fawn recruitment after taking initiative to remove predators, primarily coyotes..
Somehow these properties didn't see increases in deer density tho.
Maybe this allows more of your healthiest deer to survive tho. Allowing them to reach an age where they can fend for themselves before they are picked off..
 
Hitting fawn predators as hard as possible just before fawning time appears to produce the most dramatic increases in fawn survival.
 
What we need is a piece of ground that has some years of history regarding fawn survival history. Then trap the place hard. Then watch recruitment levels. Who would own a piece of land like that?????????

Sorry BSK.

Two things I do know about coyote predation: (1) they move into your neighborhood there will be no stray cats or dogs within 2 months. (2) Toddler-sized humans or deer are prey.

I have observed coyotes chasing down ground squirrels. Fawns & poults don't have a chance.
 
I've always been convinced of what scn mentioned. Take out the alpha female and/or male and all the coyotes will start breeding until a new alpha pair has been determined. This will actually increase populations unless you're doing some heavy and productive shooting and trapping removal. I also agree that just before fawns are dropped and turkeys nest and hatch would be an ideal time to take out a few dogs. However the benefit you reap may only be for that short birthing period if heavy breeding occurs as a result.
 
scn said:
I've been told by coyote experts that a lot depends on which coyote you remove. They supposedly have some pretty strict "social order" that if memory serves me correct is controlled by an "alpha" female. As long as she is in control, the actual yote population may be surpressed. If you kill her, it may allow an increased number of yotes to expand into that range until another alpha animal emerges and the population goes back down. You actually end up with increasing your yote population.

Make sure you shoot the right one!

Which experts specifically are you referring to? That sounds more like wolf population dynamics than coyote. Coyotes are not strictly territorial like wolves, and they are also not pack animals. They do associate in loose family groups that disperse after a year or a couple of years, especially the males.

I have heard theories about short term population reductions stimulating increase in litter size as food availability increases, thereby causing increased population if mortality levels don't remain high. I don't find that theory to be cogent. I have usually seen it propounded by animal rights activists who don't want any coyotes killed. Even if it were accurate, it would only make sense when coyote populations are at or near carrying capacity of their range, which I don't think is the case in most eastern states....they are still expanding here.

Consider this: native muskrat populations have plummeted in recent years across the native range, and there is no consensus regarding the cause. How much do we really know about coyotes if we can't even figure out concrete population shifts in muskrats?

Also consider this: many studies have been done on the coyote, paid for by the federal government. They have not been eradicated and have spread like wildfire in the east, increasing their range significantly over where it was before the white man came. Some say they cannot be controlled. However, DNA evidence also suggests that the eastern red wolf is actually just coyote with a bit of dog mixed in. And the red wolf was extirpated from the eastern range just like the grey wolf was extirpated from much of the western range. So if the red wolf is really just a coyote, and it was extirpated, why can't the coyote be controlled?

Part of the problem in much of the southeast is the live market. Dog hunters like to run coyotes and they paid big money to bring them in. They still pay big money in many states where it is legal. Most coyotes trapped in some states end up sold to the pens. They get out and the problem goes on. It just spreads them around.

Coyotes hunt in family groups. Every coyote killed reduces the effectiveness of that hunting unit to bring down larger prey like deer.

If you already have too many deer on your property, than predation due to coyotes may not even be a problem, to the extent that they are killing the excess. It may be viewed a problem if they are killing mature bucks that survive hunting season but are weakened after the season.

Consistent trapping of coyotes in an areas is the best way to reduce the population. If you do nothing, they will surely continue to increase. If you kill a bunch, they still may increase but not as quickly. If your property aligns with terrain features that coyotes will use as dispersal corridors, you will always have a lot of coyotes moving through the area. Find the best locations to trap them and keep the trap working.

Here are two locations where I have caught over 30 K9's in the last 2 seasons, the first one 7 coyotes, the second one 4 coyotes and a couple doze fox. Nobody had seen a coyote in the area until 5-6 years ago:



 
DaveB said:
What we need is a piece of ground that has some years of history regarding fawn survival history. Then trap the place hard. Then watch recruitment levels.

This has been done. It does help with that year's fawn survival. However, the long-term implications are not known. In essence, does this help depleted local deer populations rebound?

Some of the best deer-coyote studies have been done on government/military properties in South Carolina.
 
I am just reluctant to believe that coyotes are a major problem for deer and turkeys. I think they get the blame because they are the only thing around with big teeth. I would like to see some research done on how much better the turkey or deer population grew with coyote killing. I am sure they catch a few fawns, but it isn't many. They may get a hen on the nest, but I do not believe it is many.

Coyotes actually help in control of the varmints like coons and possums that are so bad on turkey nest. If we didn't have coyotes there would be too many other things, therefore I believe in struggling even more than now wild turkeys.

But, this is a whitetail deer world these days, and that is all most people care about.
 
woodsman87 said:
I am sure they catch a few fawns, but it isn't many.

In some Southeastern studies, especially in the Deep South, coyotes killed 50-80% of fawns born each year.
 
I would imagine coyotes are a wash on turkeys....they probably kill enough fox and other egg eaters to make up for the ones they kill. But there is no doubt they catch and kill plenty of turkeys.

As for deer, they definately kill deer fawn through adult. The overall impact on the deer population will vary according to a number of factors. If there are way too many deer in the area, predation is probably a good thing. If the herd is declining, coyotes could do a lot of damage.
 
There is a military base in SC that may have to end their public hunts. Coyote are killing so many fawns that the deer population is being held quite low, and declining. The deer population loss to hunting, in combination with the loss to coyotes, might be enough to drive the deer population below sustainable levels.

In some situations, coyotes can have a massive impact. In others, not so much. I would only worry greatly about coyotes if a local deer population displayed signs of declining, in combination with low fawn survival. That would be the sign of excessive predation mortality (from both humans and coyotes).
 
In our last post season survey we had something near 60% fawn recruitment, this past yr was 39%.. I get pics of coyotes chasing deer on trail cam all the time.. Hunters on our place have even witnessed coyotes carrying deer legs.. I think they kill more deer and especially turkey than most can imagine!
In any attempt to trap coyotes, your also gunna catch a few foxes and bobcats also...
 
Had a hunter on my place actually watch two coyotes take down a gobbler last week. Really need to learn how to run traps or find someone that will.
 
When is the season for coyote trapping?Same as all the other trapping season or is it different?Maybe if we had a two or three week season in spring when we weren't afraid to bump our deer as bad would be good.Id love to catch a couple.
 
I run a camera 24/7/365 on my property and I've got more coyote pictures now than I ever have before they were trapped. I have as many as 5 at a time in one single picture. I believe once the dominate male and female were taken out the surrounding packs moved in.

I was allowed to trap where I work at for several years starting 10 years ago and consider it and "island".... 200 acres within city limits. I caught 14 coyotes, several red and gray foxes, and over 50 coons and a ton of possums and skunks in short order. Not a single coyote was seen or caught for 2 years. There was NO turkey or quail population and only a single doe deer.
Turkeys showed up and grew into a huntable population (even thou we weren't allowed to hunt them) and we had 2 coveys of quail and the deer population was up to 5. 3 years ago there was a change in management and I'm no longer allowed to trap and the coyotes have came back in force. No one saw a fawn last year, I've not heard a single quail call this spring and the turkey populatin went from over 30 hens to (today) 5 known hens, 1 tom and 2 jakes. We now see coyotes at any time of the day and even in packs.
Call it cruel, inhumane or whatever you will but, I personally believe that aggressively trapping ALL critters, skunks, possums, and coons included, will help all wildlife. They need managed just like deer and turkey.
 

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