Too many people get caught up in the numbers game...I can take a load of #9s and shred paper but dont think it will perform on an ol gobblers noggin the way I want it too... I would really like to know how many people really get the results Nitro Ray posts on his website...I will tell you this I have tried this shell and that shell from him with this choke and that choke and it has never worked for me...He dont seem to have an answer either except "well send us your gun and we will figure it out." No sir, I will keep that $350 thank you!!! It dont take 250 pellets in a 10" circle @40yds to kill a turkey.....and besides that most guns wont do it...blame it on temp, wind, barrel length, dirty barrel I have heard it all from Nitro Ray. Bottom line most guns wont do it!!! With that being said Nitro is the baddest loads I have shot, but I just cant justify shooting them because of the price....one other thing they are loaded very "hot" so I would caution anyone using a semi-auto to be careful..there is a reason he always talks about single shots and pumps doing the best. I have seen more than one semi-auto have something break after shooting these loads, mostly extractors.