Lets talk LBL

[AT Hiker]

Population and management specifically.

Other than bag limits and "bonus bird" nothing has changed much. The habit has matured and hogs have moved in but has that reduced the population that much?
Season structure appears to be fairly well aligned with breeding and nesting. I believe it's 6 quota days spread out over 9 days, usually starting the second week of April then a open hunt starts mid April for approximately 2 weeks.

I guess my point is, something has happened to turkeys. Ft. Campbell is having issues, more and more parts of the state are having issues but is it something that outlawing decoys, restructuring season, lowering limits can fix?

I know I will get chastised for this but here it goes....Climate Change (I'm intentionally leaving out mans role) already has many biologist to believe that it's effects on ducks is real and happening. Are we seeing the beginning of this effect on the Wild Turkey now?

For TN I believe, whatever is causing the decline, is compounded by side effects of our own success. Other states, that have seasons more aligned with flock dynamics are slowing the effects.

I just look at LBL and think "not very long ago I could go out there during the non quota and have a really good hunt, now I considering just having a bird respond to a call a good hunt".


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[Bone Collector]

Re: Lets talk LBL

IDK what is happening, but it is happening. I think with Turkeys it is a combination of all of or some of the following things, including over killing, decoys, nest predators raiding nests, and habitat change (those are the main causes IMO). The only thing game agencies can effectively change is season lengths and bag limits. Personally I like the 45 day season, but I would like to see them lower the limit to 3, and make it illegal to use male bird decoys or fan/reap birds. I DO NOT think it will effect license sales, as most folks that hunt turkeys hunt deer too and if they want to hunt deer, they will have to purchase a license and a big game tag. It would put a small dent in the hunting economy with the lost sales from the gadgets that are being sold. I think by lowering the limit by 1 bird, and making male turkey decoys, as well as fanning illegal, you have compromised with both types of turkey hunters (new school/old school) and you will see turkey kills plummet, but not because of population decline, but rather lack of ease. I think something like that will help them rebound some, but we still have to do a better job of predator control, IMO.

I do not think climate change is the culprit. I do think that the only effect humans have on climate change is our population, and everything else is just symptoms of the man cause - over population (fossil fuel use, etc.). If this is having an affect, unless we are going to kill off over half the worlds population, then we may as well just accept it, because it isn't going to change, unless Mother Nature corrects the problem (over population) with a nasty plague.

 

[poorhunter]

Re: Lets talk LBL

Not due to global warming IMO since they live in all sorts of climates anyway. Based on what I have seen where I live and hunt, the problem is some sort of disease. I get to see/watch them year round, and they disappeared overnight. They were there like always, and then they were gone. Not slowly and gradually, not just toms, not just hens, but the whole flocks were gone. I cannot think of anything else that decimates a population so quickly except disease. I am only speaking about where I live. I cannot speak about the rest of the state.

 

[TLRanger]

Re: Lets talk LBL

I hunt LBL every year....Started the year they first opened turkey season there. I think it was 1977 or 1978. The very first year they opened, there was a total of seven birds killed.

The population has its peaks and valleys but I still see plenty of gobblers and hens every year. The total kill numbers usually vary mostly because of weather conditions during their two week season and the two quota hunts. The main thing there is you have to get off the road and actually hunt, not ride the roads and stick a box call or owl hooter out the window ever 1/4 mile.

Headed there for the first quota hunt this Tuesday & Wednesday (9th & 10th). Will go back for a few days of the non quota hunts.
This is my 41st year of hunting there.

 

[tickweed]

Re: Lets talk LBL

Yes, I remember the early yrs. I thought it was a little before 77-78. Man, birds where gobblin everywhere.

 

[TLRanger]

Re: Lets talk LBL

Yes, I remember the early yrs. I thought it was a little before 77-78. Man, birds where gobblin everywhere.

It may have been earlier but I only have pics from 78 and later....I have searched all my old pics and tags but could not find any earlier.
Wish I had saved all the permits and information but didn't.

 

[REN]

Re: Lets talk LBL

Wish I had the answers, there are so many variables its seems though. Turkeys are super adaptive but also have a short lifespan for the most part so you have a few bad hatches over a stretch with increased predators and decreasing habitat and all the other factors start to compound. Maturing forest has some effect cause the food sources start to dwindle as a forest gets past a mature age. Add hunting success, flooding, crazy late freezes from time to time and lack of rain in the late summer can all drive population stress

As the population grew in the 2000's so did the population that eats them. As the number of turkeys gets lower the predators have to work harder but their numbers will not decline as fast cause they can shift their food sources around to make up for it. Then those animals populations get lower until the predator numbers start to get lower. All of it has swings and effects on the ecosystem that hopefully can bounce back and find a balance (wishful thinking) add in non native species of plants and animals like hogs and they choke out the natural habitat and food sources which also have a ripple effect.

again I have no idea what the cause is, and I wish it was as easy as a few simple things. Would be interesting to see what the public would do if the same thing was happening with Deer. Bet there would be some changes then