Southern Sportsman
Well-Known Member
He doesn't look old to me, but I'm not great at aging them this time of year. 3 yr old or talented 2 yr old?
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Thoughts?
- Thread starter Southern Sportsman
- Start date
I'll go with 3.5
That's the kinda buck we dream of seeing at 5.5-6.5. Tons of potential
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That's the kinda buck we dream of seeing at 5.5-6.5. Tons of potential
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ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER
Well-Known Member
Lucky to be 2 1/2, beautiful buck
Legs are kinda long to be 3 but I'm leaning that way due to chest and slight sag in back. He will look completely different in 30-45 days.
TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
If you only posted that top pic,
I would be saying 2 1/2 or older.
If you only posted that bottom pic,
I would be saying 3 1/2 or older.
I would be hoping he is a top-end 2 1/2,
as that might mean his antlers become truly monstrous
should he survive only another year or two.
In terms of mainframe score, he appears above average for a 3 1/2 TN buck,
although his lack of mass in more congruent with 2 1/2.
But then, those stickers are more congruent with a fully mature buck!
Very unique rack!
My best guess is he's 3 1/2.
I would be saying 2 1/2 or older.
If you only posted that bottom pic,
I would be saying 3 1/2 or older.
I would be hoping he is a top-end 2 1/2,
as that might mean his antlers become truly monstrous
should he survive only another year or two.
In terms of mainframe score, he appears above average for a 3 1/2 TN buck,
although his lack of mass in more congruent with 2 1/2.
But then, those stickers are more congruent with a fully mature buck!
Very unique rack!
My best guess is he's 3 1/2.
Southern Sportsman
Well-Known Member
Couple more angles
TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
With those new pics, I'm changing my "guess".
Your buck is 2 1/2 or older.
And, a very "top-end" uniquely antlered one.
Your buck is 2 1/2 or older.
And, a very "top-end" uniquely antlered one.
I too am torn between 2.5 and 3.5. The neck make me think 3.5 but everything else screams 2.5.
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tree_ghost
Well-Known Member
TheLBLman":2xvqct49 said:
I am thinking the same thing myself. He's quite the specimen!
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TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
I suspect he is what we call a "Tweener".
High probability he was early-born if a 2 1/2,
or late-born if a 3 1/2.
High probability he was early-born if a 2 1/2,
or late-born if a 3 1/2.
JCDEERMAN
Well-Known Member
High end 2.5
MickThompson
Well-Known Member
Body says top end 2.5 to me. Shoot it if that deer makes you happy and then we can all argue over the teeth.
Southern Sportsman
Well-Known Member
MickThompson":3te8ab0w said:
As long as he doesn't wander too far, he'll be safe for at least this year. He should be easy to identify next year if he makes it.
2.5
TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
OK, here's the rest of my thoughts . . . . .
All you can do is all you can do, and that's not shoot him yourself.
He has zero chance of surviving another year if you shoot him.
Unfortunately, assuming he is in fact only 2 1/2, likely less than 50% chance he'll see 3 1/2 even if you frequently give him a pass.
I suspect he will rut-range at least over a mile from where you're seeing him regularly now.
Worse, 2 1/2-yr-old bucks behave very stupidly (they are actually "easy marks" for novice hunters) by moving great distances during daylight.
Compare them to a 16-yr-old boy who just obtained his driver's license and was given a new sports car.
Then, not having a fully developed skeletal system, a 2 1/2 is generally "small bodied" compared to an older buck, so this makes his antlers appear MUCH larger than their actual size. With those long G-2's, some hunter down the road not recognizing, may actually think he's seeing a much larger antlered buck, and will immediately pull the trigger.
This is called "high grading" (of antlers) and it's the main reason we don't have more large antlered older bucks in Tennessee.
We have plenty of older bucks with small antlers, simply because so many hunters had no problem giving them a pass when they were spikes and 4-pointers, and/or smaller-than-average racks as 2 1/2's.
Antler high grading is when hunters are quicker to kill young bucks with superior genetics, while simultaneously eager to pass, sometimes even 3 1/2 & older bucks with genetically poor antlers. We often see similar with select timber cutting when mainly "nice" oaks are cut, while less desirable trees are not cut (like sweet gum, locust, beech). The forest becomes one of less desirable (but old) trees. Similarly, our deer herd has become one of many older bucks with small antlers.
Should "your" particular buck survive to 3 1/2, he will have such an impressive rack that he will be much more specifically and heavily hunted by multiple hunters all around the area. He will behave much smarter, and be a greater hunting challenge, but the increased specific hunting for him still makes it less likely he might survive to 4 1/2, which is the age at which he approaches his real antler size potential.
This is just the reality of how this works.
No chance of him surviving another year if you shoot him, small chance if you don't.
And his antlers probably won't hit maximum size, score, and uniqueness before the age of 5 1/2.
All you can do is all you can do, and that's not shoot him yourself.
He has zero chance of surviving another year if you shoot him.
Unfortunately, assuming he is in fact only 2 1/2, likely less than 50% chance he'll see 3 1/2 even if you frequently give him a pass.
Therein lies the problem.Southern Sportsman":357swm1i said:
I suspect he will rut-range at least over a mile from where you're seeing him regularly now.
Worse, 2 1/2-yr-old bucks behave very stupidly (they are actually "easy marks" for novice hunters) by moving great distances during daylight.
Compare them to a 16-yr-old boy who just obtained his driver's license and was given a new sports car.
Then, not having a fully developed skeletal system, a 2 1/2 is generally "small bodied" compared to an older buck, so this makes his antlers appear MUCH larger than their actual size. With those long G-2's, some hunter down the road not recognizing, may actually think he's seeing a much larger antlered buck, and will immediately pull the trigger.
This is called "high grading" (of antlers) and it's the main reason we don't have more large antlered older bucks in Tennessee.
We have plenty of older bucks with small antlers, simply because so many hunters had no problem giving them a pass when they were spikes and 4-pointers, and/or smaller-than-average racks as 2 1/2's.
Antler high grading is when hunters are quicker to kill young bucks with superior genetics, while simultaneously eager to pass, sometimes even 3 1/2 & older bucks with genetically poor antlers. We often see similar with select timber cutting when mainly "nice" oaks are cut, while less desirable trees are not cut (like sweet gum, locust, beech). The forest becomes one of less desirable (but old) trees. Similarly, our deer herd has become one of many older bucks with small antlers.
Should "your" particular buck survive to 3 1/2, he will have such an impressive rack that he will be much more specifically and heavily hunted by multiple hunters all around the area. He will behave much smarter, and be a greater hunting challenge, but the increased specific hunting for him still makes it less likely he might survive to 4 1/2, which is the age at which he approaches his real antler size potential.
This is just the reality of how this works.
No chance of him surviving another year if you shoot him, small chance if you don't.
And his antlers probably won't hit maximum size, score, and uniqueness before the age of 5 1/2.
Southern Sportsman
Well-Known Member
We have had pretty decent luck with deer surviving to the next year. Decent sized section of land with really good habitat and minimal hunting pressure on the adjoining ground. That said, absent a high fence, there is always a chance someone else will kill a deer you pass. And I'm 100% okay with that. If he goes onto someone else's land and would make another hunter happy, they should shoot him. But if I shot him I would be more disappointed than happy. I would much rather pass him and never see him again than shoot him and never see him again.
TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
Southern Sportsmen, my "attitude" is very similar to yours.
The exception to this are the really "top-end" antlered 2 1/2-yr-old & 3 1/2-yr-old bucks.
The buck has zero chance if I kill him; he at least has a chance if I don't.
Where I'm disappointed is when a very avid & accomplished hunter, one who brags about all the small-antlered bucks he passes (and indeed does, and indeed also kills some fully mature bucks), still continues to kill those top-end 2 1/2 & 3 1/2's that so many less accomplished hunters have eagerly passed up, but then seemingly just for "him", that accomplished hunter one would have thought, would more easily see the benefits of passing up a top-end young buck. That is something I don't understand, even if it does "make HIM happy". OUR efforts are more about "us" than just "him".
That said, "a" buck is very seldom "my" buck or "your" buck, but is more like "our" buck.
Many times I have had a particular buck I felt I was likely to kill in a particular area, only to find out later someone else had killed him 2 miles (and farther) from where I thought I had the best opportunity. I don't think most hunters fully appreciate just how far rutting bucks roam, much less how any particular buck's normal range typically extends onto land owned by several different landowners.
When a particular buck's full range is known, it can be almost comical to hear all the various different hunters talk about that buck "they have" over on "my place", and I'm planning to kill him during the rut. May be 6 different hunters 6 miles apart thinking the same thing about that same buck.
Another issue is how much harder and how many more days most hunters will hunt (annually) when they're specifically targeting a particular desired buck for which they believe they have a fair chance of killing. Then there is the risk of the buck being poached going higher, as well as the issue of many hunters being more willing to take a low-probability shot on a "buck of a lifetime". People will take greater risks, sometimes do things unethical or illegal, when the rewards are greater?
For many, many reasons, the mortality rate on a top-end antlered buck (of any age) is much higher than for his same-age cohort.
Only stating this above because it is the reality most of us are experiencing in trying to help a top-end younger buck live to 4 1/2 or older.
Same here.Southern Sportsman":3lmvg3gp said:
The exception to this are the really "top-end" antlered 2 1/2-yr-old & 3 1/2-yr-old bucks.
At least by TN standards, this statement describes my situation as well.Southern Sportsman":3lmvg3gp said:
Same here.Southern Sportsman":3lmvg3gp said:
The buck has zero chance if I kill him; he at least has a chance if I don't.
I'm in general agreement with that, especially when a particular buck is the largest one a particular hunter has ever killed.Southern Sportsman":3lmvg3gp said:
Where I'm disappointed is when a very avid & accomplished hunter, one who brags about all the small-antlered bucks he passes (and indeed does, and indeed also kills some fully mature bucks), still continues to kill those top-end 2 1/2 & 3 1/2's that so many less accomplished hunters have eagerly passed up, but then seemingly just for "him", that accomplished hunter one would have thought, would more easily see the benefits of passing up a top-end young buck. That is something I don't understand, even if it does "make HIM happy". OUR efforts are more about "us" than just "him".
That said, "a" buck is very seldom "my" buck or "your" buck, but is more like "our" buck.
Many times I have had a particular buck I felt I was likely to kill in a particular area, only to find out later someone else had killed him 2 miles (and farther) from where I thought I had the best opportunity. I don't think most hunters fully appreciate just how far rutting bucks roam, much less how any particular buck's normal range typically extends onto land owned by several different landowners.
When a particular buck's full range is known, it can be almost comical to hear all the various different hunters talk about that buck "they have" over on "my place", and I'm planning to kill him during the rut. May be 6 different hunters 6 miles apart thinking the same thing about that same buck.
Another issue is how much harder and how many more days most hunters will hunt (annually) when they're specifically targeting a particular desired buck for which they believe they have a fair chance of killing. Then there is the risk of the buck being poached going higher, as well as the issue of many hunters being more willing to take a low-probability shot on a "buck of a lifetime". People will take greater risks, sometimes do things unethical or illegal, when the rewards are greater?
For many, many reasons, the mortality rate on a top-end antlered buck (of any age) is much higher than for his same-age cohort.
Only stating this above because it is the reality most of us are experiencing in trying to help a top-end younger buck live to 4 1/2 or older.
megalomaniac
Well-Known Member
2.5 yo
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