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CWD a hoax?

BSK said:
I've heard this "it's the insurance companies" line ever since liberal antlerless limits began surfacing. I've also talked to many state wildlife heads and they all say they've never once received a call or contact from an insurance company. Insurance companies don't lobby for less deer, they just raise their rates in high deer density areas to cover their claims.
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keep drinking the koolaid my friend!
 
fairchaser said:
This guy is smart but I think he's on a mission to prove his mineral deficiency theory to the world. Ames has more nutrition on their landscape than anyplace I've ever hunted. The reason is to feed the quail and the by product is the other wildlife as well. Studies have been done to measure the nutritional quality and quantity of the resource and it was found to be more than ample. It's nowhere near carrying capacity. Yet Ames has more CWD than other areas that have much less nutrition such as east TN. His claims don't pass the common sense test! Sorry Doc.
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he didnt say food, he said minerals
 
Some people make their minds about something and no matter how much science is brought to bear, they come up with a reason why it can't be true. That's called confirmation bias. Only information that supports their predetermined opinions are allowed into their thinking. Everything else is chalked up to politics, money or a secret agenda. None of us is truly opened minded but some are just downright hard headed. If we already know everything, how do we ever truly learn anything new? Ive been humbled many times with my incorrect thinking by folks more knowledgeable than me like BSK and Mega. Let's try to stay open minded. Our future deer herd and probably a lot more depend on it. Thank you.
 
fairchaser said:
Some people make their minds about something and no matter how much science is brought to bear, they come up with a reason why it can't be true. That's called confirmation bias. Only information that supports their predetermined opinions are allowed into their thinking. Everything else is chalked up to politics, money or a secret agenda. None of us is truly opened minded but some are just downright hard headed. If we already know everything, how do we ever truly learn anything new? Ive been humbled many times with my incorrect thinking by folks more knowledgeable than me like BSK and Mega. Let's try to stay open minded. Our future deer herd and probably a lot more depend on it. Thank you.
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So true. Like one fact is worth more than a thousand opinions.
 
MidTennFisher said:
This doesn't exactly show a population crash. And really it doesn't show much of anything without a legend to tell us what the blue/red means.

The chart posted several posts above yours shows quite a population growth of deer during the same years that CWD cases have continued to increase. How can that be if CWD is so deadly like we are told?

But again I still ask the question - where are all the dead deer, elk, and moose laying around in the CWD states with no sign of any physical injury? If CWD was as deadly as state agencies who benefit from federal funding to "combat CWD" say it is (see what I did there?) then surely we'd see dead deer and elk in 30+ states with no reason to be dead other than testing positive for CWD.

Wisconsin, I believe, still has the highest deer density in the country. And there are a lot of deer hunters. I think they're in the top 5 for hunting population so surely those hunters would be seeing dead deer in the woods. No?
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Let me ask you this- if humans had no access to medical care, how many of us would you find dead "in the wild" with no apparent signs of trauma, with or without a degenerative brain disease?
 
MickThompson said:
Let me ask you this- if humans had no access to medical care, how many of us would you find dead "in the wild" with no apparent signs of trauma, with or without a degenerative brain disease?
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If there was some sort of rapidly spreading disease with a high death rate? Probably quite a bit. Sort of like the plague days in Europe.
 
MickThompson said:
CWD doesn't spread or kill quickly
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Sounds like even more reason to not kill an entire deer herd in bigger numbers than CWD could, then. Too many states have been dealing with this for too long, despite doing these extended rifle seasons with liberal limits, to convince me that it does much good. Those states still have CWD and it still shows up in new areas.

Who is to say it kills deer at all? I'm told it does, but where is the evidence? Where are all the deer that were, beyond a shadow of any doubt, dead purely because they contracted CWD? Are so many dying that we really need these extreme measures? Mostly I just see articles saying that it kills deer, but there is no evidence other than a "trust the science" kind of feel. Where have I heard that one before?

I did some Google searches and was able to find 2 accounts of a hunter watching a deer drop dead for no reason. It was tested and CWD positive. Sorry but that doesn't quite justify attempting to kill off every deer in West TN.

A lot of this stuff reminds me of Covid. I don't buy into the idea that it's a complete hoax but I do believe it is greatly exaggerated. Once you realize there is Federal funding involved things get even more suspect. Just like Covid.
 
MidTennFisher said:
Sounds like even more reason to not kill an entire deer herd in bigger numbers than CWD could, then. Too many states have been dealing with this for too long, despite doing these extended rifle seasons with liberal limits, to convince me that it does much good. Those states still have CWD and it still shows up in new areas.

Who is to say it kills deer at all? I'm told it does, but where is the evidence? Where are all the deer that were, beyond a shadow of any doubt, dead purely because they contracted CWD? Are so many dying that we really need these extreme measures? Mostly I just see articles saying that it kills deer, but there is no evidence other than a "trust the science" kind of feel. Where have I heard that one before?

I did some Google searches and was able to find 2 accounts of a hunter watching a deer drop dead for no reason. It was tested and CWD positive. Sorry but that doesn't quite justify attempting to kill off every deer in West TN.

A lot of this stuff reminds me of Covid. I don't buy into the idea that it's a complete hoax but I do believe it is greatly exaggerated. Once you realize there is Federal funding involved things get even more suspect. Just like Covid.
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It's not a hoax. The problem with it is the prions (proteins) stay on the ground for a long time and maybe forever. Prions are not a living cell but a protein that has different characteristics than the normal protein. When it gets into the animals system it confuses the normal proteins which causes CWD. My son tried to explain it to me and that's what I got out of it. He's a microbiologist.
 
If you look at harvest data, hunters are not killing any more deer now than before CWD in the CWD zone. At the most recent TWFC meeting, TWRA officials actually said that the more liberalized seasons and incentives they have put in place in the CWD zone is not resulting in more hunter killed deer. They normalized the data and put it on a deer per hunter basis and it was the same in the 5 years since CWD was discovered as in the 5 years prior — about 1.8 deer per hunter. They put incentives in placing to encourage hunters for a higher kill but it hasn't happened. It is a false narrative that TWRA deer hunting regulations are wiping out the herd in West Tennessee.
 
JJ3 said:
If you look at harvest data, hunters are not killing any more deer now than before CWD in the CWD zone. At the most recent TWFC meeting, TWRA officials actually said that the more liberalized seasons and incentives they have put in place in the CWD zone is not resulting in more hunter killed deer. They normalized the data and put it on a deer per hunter basis and it was the same in the 5 years since CWD was discovered as in the 5 years prior — about 1.8 deer per hunter. They put incentives in placing to encourage hunters for a higher kill but it hasn't happened. It is a false narrative that TWRA deer hunting regulations are wiping out the herd in West Tennessee.
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Much agreed. I see many people post about TWRA and CWD regs wiping out the deer herd. In the epicenter of CWD and around it, the prevalance rate has gotten so high, you probably couldn't wipe out the her if you wanted to. So if the herd was being wiped out by CWD regs, why are Fayette and Hardeman Co deer kills dropping way below what they used to be? And as for finding one that died of CWD rather than being killed, last I checked the buzzards and coyotes don't take their deer in to have them checked and tested.
 
BigAl said:
Much agreed. I see many people post about TWRA and CWD regs wiping out the deer herd. In the epicenter of CWD and around it, the prevalance rate has gotten so high, you probably couldn't wipe out the her if you wanted to. So if the herd was being wiped out by CWD regs, why are Fayette and Hardeman Co deer kills dropping way below what they used to be? And as for finding one that died of CWD rather than being killed, last I checked the buzzards and coyotes don't take their deer in to have them checked and tested.
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Oh so you have a lot of bone piles around your area huh?
 
7mmWSM said:
Oh so you have a lot of bone piles around your area huh?
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I dont really go looking for them, especially in the offseason. I've found deer on our place that had been killed by something (probably lots of reasons) and it doesn't take long for the evidence to disappear. I've seen deer in my back yard, actually on my back porch, that I'm pretty sure had CWD. Did I go outside and take a nasal swab to test it? Nope. Not sure of this tendancy to believe CWD isn't killing deer, pretty sure I've seen it and the effects. Just like people deny covid was killing humans. I know people that died from it. IMO you can critize the response to either and how we handle it, but can't understand denying it occurs.
 
BigAl said:
I dont really go looking for them, especially in the offseason. I've found deer on our place that had been killed by something (probably lots of reasons) and it doesn't take long for the evidence to disappear. I've seen deer in my back yard, actually on my back porch, that I'm pretty sure had CWD. Did I go outside and take a nasal swab to test it? Nope. Not sure of this tendancy to believe CWD isn't killing deer, pretty sure I've seen it and the effects. Just like people deny covid was killing humans. I know people that died from it. IMO you can critize the response to either and how we handle it, but can't understand denying it occurs.
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When I see proof from TWRA on a deer that died from CWD I'll believe it. They died from a bullet wound or EHD. Like I've said before in these subdivisions that's run over with deer if they were dying they'd be getting tested. Don't you believe that? I guarantee you and you know as well someone would be checking on it. You don't hear of that because it's not happening.
Next time you have one in your yard or on your back porch that dies get it tested and let us know how that goes.
Believe it's all gloom and doom if you'd like but until the state can prove otherwise I call bu$$$hit. I'm still enjoying the fruits of my hunting like I have the past 30+yrs. Oh and I'm within throwing distance of Ames as well
 
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7mmWSM said:
When I see proof from TWRA on a deer that died from CWD I'll believe it. They died from a bullet wound or EHD. Like I've said before in these subdivisions that's run over with deer if they were dying they'd be getting tested. Don't you believe that? I guarantee you and you know as well someone would be checking on it. You don't hear of that because it's not happening.
Next time you have one in your yard or on your back porch that dies get it tested and let us know how that goes.
Believe it's all gloom and doom if you'd like but until the state can prove otherwise I call bu$$$hit. I'm still enjoying the fruits of my hunting like I have the past 30+yrs. Oh and I'm within throwing distance of Ames as well
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When you see a mature buck swimming in circles in a cow pond in December when it's 30 degrees, you can bet that buck has a neurological disease like CWD or maybe he just likes cold water. That buck will likely wander by a hunter or in front of a truck. But if he doesn't then the coyotes will get him. That's just one example but also found excessive numbers of dead deer and dead heads. We got a barn full of them next time you drive by our check station, stop and take a look!
 
fairchaser said:
When you see a mature buck swimming in circles in a cow pond in December when it's 30 degrees, you can bet that buck has a neurological disease like CWD or maybe he just likes cold water. That buck will likely wander by a hunter or in front of a truck. But if he doesn't then the coyotes will get him. That's just one example but also found excessive numbers of dead deer and dead heads. We got a barn full of them next time you drive by our check station, stop and take a look!
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EHD does the same thing. Next time one dies THEN check it for CWD not after it was killed by a hunter. It'll be the first one that died on it own from CWD that I've ever heard of. Except those from old age.
But keep thinking that and be down about the hunting while the rest of us are having a ball like we were 10yrs ago and more. Killing the mature infected CWD deer now just like they were back then. CWD didn't just start 5yrs ago I assure you.
Us that live and hunt close by Ames see plenty of healthy deer. We get a kick out of y'all David gloom and doomers.
Let me ask you what's the age limit of the bucks with CWD? Because if it's past 5-1/2 to 6-1/2yrs old then we're good. Because we see and kill those every year. Some test positive no doubt but they're all healthy as a horse.
 
fairchaser said:
When you see a mature buck swimming in circles in a cow pond in December when it's 30 degrees, you can bet that buck has a neurological disease like CWD or maybe he just likes cold water. That buck will likely wander by a hunter or in front of a truck. But if he doesn't then the coyotes will get him. That's just one example but also found excessive numbers of dead deer and dead heads. We got a barn full of them next time you drive by our check station, stop and take a look!
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The deniers will tell you that deer drowned. CWD didn't kill it.
 
TWRA and other states have very limited ways to fight this, they can ignore it and let it run its course and maybe drive the herds back to almost record lows or they can try to reduce the herd so it spreads slower, they may never figure out a way to stop or decrease it but to say it's a hoax is really out there imo.
 

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