I am starting to believe in climate change…

[Iglow]

There's a difference between man-made and man-influenced.

There is simply no question that with 8 billion people on the planet we are influencing the planets climate on some level.

I wonder if any animal of similar size as humans has ever gotten to such high population levels?

 

[Ski]

Valid points all Ski. We only have very detailed data about our climate and oceans going back about 50 years. But what about cyclic patterns that occur over hundreds if not thousands of years? We have no idea about those other than just anecdotal information, such as the Roman Warm Period and the Medieval Warm Period.

Disagreements in science are not only normal, they are how science works. I cannot emphasize this enough. Science is about collecting facts and then testing hypotheses about what the facts mean. Then the scientist publishes his/her ideas and presents all of the data to the scientific community for others to test to see if they come to the same conclusions. The process works because everyone else gets to poke holes in the theories of others. Critical analysis is the cornerstone of science. However, we have recently moved into a "new" (and disastrous) form of "science." When you have "scientists" (read political/social activists masquerading as scientists) hiding the data, or even worse, altering the data so it comes out the way they want it to, science is officially dead. And that's where we're at.

Unfortunate but I agree. Strange times. Political activism has replaced religious activism. Both have been detrimental to actual science.

Back in the real world the reason for the warm spell is irrelevant. Deer still have to do what deer do to survive. If that means adapting behavior then in order to hunt them we also will have to adapt our approach.....and expectations.

 

[BSK]

Another MAJOR problem is the fallibility of human memory. Often I will hear people say, "This is the hottest (or coldest) I can ever remember," but looking at official records, it has been hotter or colder many times. People just forget. How many people realize the hottest period in American history was the mid 1930s, during the Dust Bowl era? Temps then were MUCH higher than today.

I just took a quick glance through the detailed daily weather data I've been keeping during hunting season since 1987. I found all sorts of late hot periods around this time of year into MZ season. The high temp was 84 degrees on Oct. 27 in 1989. 80 degrees on Nov. 8, 1999. 81 on Oct. 28, 2000. 82 on Nov. 3, 2003. 81 on Nov. 15, 2009, etc. I even found 78 degrees on Thanksgiving, 1999.

 

[348Winchester]

The Vikings grew grain in Greenland one thousand years ago. It was warmer. The earth's temperatures wax and wane. BSK has posed an excellent question.

Why/how do ocean temperatures change?

The sun, earths inner core heating/cooling, both, or neither.

I don't know but there is an answer when the correct question is asked.

 

[BSK]

The Vikings grew grain in Greenland one thousand years ago. It was warmer. The earth's temperatures wax and wane. BSK has posed an excellent question.

Why/how do ocean temperatures change?

The sun, earths inner core heating/cooling, both, or neither.

I don't know but there is an answer when the correct question is asked.

Two interesting observations: The SE Pacific region - near SE Asia - has been experiencing much clearer skies over the last decade or so. This allows sunlight to penetrate deeper into the ocean waters and warm them. Yet, is the clearer skies the result of warmer waters or the cause of the warmer waters? Undersea vulcanism has been on the steady increase over the last 30 years. Are undersea volcanoes heating the oceans? Who knows. Of interest, the undersea vulcanism has been subsiding the last few years. If the oceans begin to cool in the next few years, we may have the answer.

 

[348Winchester]

Two interesting observations: The SE Pacific region - near SE Asia - has been experiencing much clearer skies over the last decade or so. This allows sunlight to penetrate deeper into the ocean waters and warm them. Yet, is the clearer skies the result of warmer waters or the cause of the warmer waters? Undersea vulcanism has been on the steady increase over the last 30 years. Are undersea volcanoes heating the oceans? Who knows. Of interest, the undersea vulcanism has been subsiding the last few years. If the oceans begin to cool in the next few years, we may have the answer.

Would cleare skies at night not result in greater heat loss as well?

 

[DeerCamp]

I wonder if any animal of similar size as humans has ever gotten to such high population levels?

Humans outnumber primates on the planet right now 100:1. It's unlikely that any population of another species of significant size has ever been higher.

There are 30,000,000 whitetail deer in North America, which is about the same as before the Europeans arrived. So about 1:10 vs Americans today.

Dinosaurs might possibly have rivaled us in terms of sheer biomass.

i don't know the answer to this question but its a fun one to think about.

 

[DeerCamp]

Another MAJOR problem is the fallibility of human memory. Often I will hear people say, "This is the hottest (or coldest) I can ever remember," but looking at official records, it has been hotter or colder many times. People just forget. How many people realize the hottest period in American history was the mid 1930s, during the Dust Bowl era? Temps then were MUCH higher than today.

I just took a quick glance through the detailed daily weather data I've been keeping during hunting season since 1987. I found all sorts of late hot periods around this time of year into MZ season. The high temp was 84 degrees on Oct. 27 in 1989. 80 degrees on Nov. 8, 1999. 81 on Oct. 28, 2000. 82 on Nov. 3, 2003. 81 on Nov. 15, 2009, etc. I even found 78 degrees on Thanksgiving, 1999.

I always like to look at local data which has less of a chance of being monkeyed with.

There's no question we are stacking a bunch of bars on the top side of the graph the last decade with very few "cooler than expected" years.

 

[woodsman04]

It's pretty upsetting to not want to hunt my favorite time other than rut. I sure enjoy or used to enjoy cool October days. Watching and listening to deer eat acorns plus the beauty of the fall foliage. Yea I could still go, but when it's in the mid 80s it just ain't the same.

 

[woodsman04]

I always like to look at local data which has less of a chance of being monkeyed with.

There's no question we are stacking a bunch of bars on the top side of the graph the last decade with very few "cooler than expected" years.

View attachment 249383

Good data here.

I would like to see a graph of just the months of October through February or something. If possible.

It's always hot and humid in the south. I do not think the summers are getting hotter. I just think our winters aren't getting as cold .

 

[Ski]

Humans outnumber primates on the planet right now 100:1. It's unlikely that any population of another species of significant size has ever been higher.

There are 30,000,000 whitetail deer in North America, which is about the same as before the Europeans arrived. So about 1:10 vs Americans today.

Dinosaurs might possibly have rivaled us in terms of sheer biomass.

i don't know the answer to this question but its a fun one to think about.

Just inside the last 10,000yrs the Amazon was a desert while the Sahara was a jungle. Half of the northern hemisphere was under a 2 mile thick glacier. Sea levels have risen enough to swallow entire civilizations. Megafauna have gone extinct. North America was a network of mega metropolitan regions interconnected with sophistication and population that rivaled anywhere in the world before suddenly disappearing.

That 10,000yrs in scale of the earth's history is akin to one road stripe on the I-10 highway. And we get all tore up over a few degree increase in global temps over a few year time. When you put things in perspective global warming as we are experiencing it seems pretty trivial, IMO.

 

[BSK]

Would cleare skies at night not result in greater heat loss as well?

Yes, except water looses its heat very, very slowly. It's why humid air stays so warm at night, while dry air loses its heat very rapidly (why it drops to below freezing in the desert at night even though it was over 100 during the day - dry air).

 

[DaveTN]

I am starting to believe in climate change

 

[BSK]

I always like to look at local data which has less of a chance of being monkeyed with.

Don't be so sure it has been "monkeyed" with. Did you know you can longer access historic raw NOAA temperature data? Their excuse is that "they're afraid people won't understand it and will use it to inaccurately assess past weather conditions." They will only allow access to "corrected" data. I'm not buying that. When "scientists" won't let you see the raw data, there's a reason for that, and it isn't "good science."

 

[BSK]

Good data here.

I would like to see a graph of just the months of October through February or something. If possible.

It's always hot and humid in the south. I do not think the summers are getting hotter. I just think our winters aren't getting as cold .

No, it isn't that afternoon high temperatures are getting hotter. It is that morning lows are getting warmer. Why is that? More moisture in the air. Humid air holds heat and won't allow the temperature to fall as far at night. And the entire world has been reporting higher dewpoints recently than what has been seen in the past. Why? Warmer oceans leading to more water vapor evaporation into the air.

 

[DaveTN]

Don't be so sure it has been "monkeyed" with. Did you know you can longer access historic raw NOAA temperature data? Their excuse is that "they're afraid people won't understand it and will use it to inaccurately assess past weather conditions." They will only allow access to "corrected" data. I'm not buying that. When "scientists" won't let you see the raw data, there's a reason for that, and it isn't "good science."

Couple that with people looking at what they have experienced over their lifetime and thinking that's a long time.

 

[PossumSlayer]

The Sun

 

[UTGrad]

Don't be so sure it has been "monkeyed" with. Did you know you can longer access historic raw NOAA temperature data? Their excuse is that "they're afraid people won't understand it and will use it to inaccurately assess past weather conditions." They will only allow access to "corrected" data. I'm not buying that. When "scientists" won't let you see the raw data, there's a reason for that, and it isn't "good science."

Scientist have become activists cause many got brain washed from woke professors.

 

[DaveTN]

Decide what you want the data or science to show. Then create the data/science to show it.

 

[backyardtndeer]

Just cyclic changes, nothing more.