Neighborhood Cooperation

[Tallredd]

Wanted to start a conversation about inspiring folks in our neighborhoods to board the QDM and habitat management train. Not just about deer management but habitat management (and even predator management) that benefits all kinds of wildlife. For example, I live in Overton County and I am fortunate enough to have a small farm with neighboring farms on both sides of me whose owners who to see bigger deer. We more or less have an understanding of not taking any bucks under 3 1/2-4 years old and mature does only. There are other neighbors (land owners and hunters who rent ground) that I would like to bring over to the light but it is definitely more challenging as they are a bit more reclusive and fall for the "if I don't shoot it now, someone else will" mentality (AKA Tragedy of the Commons).
On the habitat side of things, while my adjoining neighbors have a pretty good rule for an age limit for deer, they do not understand the value of good quality habitat. No doubt, when they hear the word "habitat" they immediately think of food plots. While food plots can be beneficial, deer are browsers and can and will eat just about any type of vegetative matter in the woods. They are more like goats than anything. I have noticed a lack of good cover for fawning and bedding in my immediate area and have tried to alleviate that by establishing buffers around field edges and even letting the back part and lest productive portions of the fields to go fallow/wild with mowing every 2-3 years . And on turkeys, trying to inspire folks that if they wait just 2 or 3 more weeks to begin hay mowing, the hen turkeys will be off the nests for the most part, and the chicks will be able to fly when jumped up.

All that to say this....do any of you have any advice or tips to engage the neighborhood landowners and hunters? What has your experience been, if any?

 

[Tallredd]

Oh yeah...for kicks, I have a place in another county where there are bigger bucks. I have thought of showing my neighbors trail cam pics of those bigger bucks, which may spur them to believing that there are some giants walking around our area, which would entice them to hunt those bigger deer and pass up these smaller ones we have running around. Guess what happens in about 2 years?! They start bagging those bigger bucks.....

 

[PickettSFHunter]

I'm one county over and have some land that is just about in Overton. There are a few large properties here that manage well for deer and they can pretty easily get deer up in older age classes but those are getting fewer and farther between. The number one issue is poaching, it's just really bad with thermal, cell cams, drones, you name it. Everyone knows of every nice buck in the Summer and it's really hard for a legal hunter to get ahead of that. You also have a lot of non-hunting landowners that are perfectly okay with poaching, it's just a culture thing. The next issue is development and the ever increasing population. There is more hunting going on than before and much less large tracts to manage for deer on. The third issue is bear predation on fawns. The amount of fawns making it past those first few weeks has dropped very low. I'm afraid to say that the good ol days are behind us in my county. Yes there are still good ones around but it's no where near what it used to be. I would love to have the cooperating neighbor situation but it's just not a reality over here, at least long term. I had it once and it was great but the guy holding that together with the large tract passed away and the landowner gave the hunting rights to poachers. Good luck in your endeavor.

 

[Planking]

I'm in Overton County. I have poachers across the street from me. They got busted a few weeks ago shooting deer from the road at night and apparently they can still go hunting. They were there shooting this morning. I agree with the post above, the good ole days of hunting are gone. I'm so frustrated dealing with thermals and road hunting at night, non hunting land owners that don't care what type of criminals they are hosting that i no longer want anything to do with the sport of hunting. Best of luck.

 

[megalomaniac]

About the only way you are going to get neighbors to focus on habitat is to improve yours to the point where they want to hunt right on your line because you have the best game (because of the habitat improvements you have made).

But that's a downside as well. New group next to one of my farms, and they cram 5 hunters on the 40ac next to me, spaced out on my line every 150y. They have killed 5 already we passed up (3.5 and younger) past week. Won't be long and it will be nigh impossible for any buck in that area to reach 4.5.

I talked with them from a safety standpoint (they have been hunting on our fencerow In areas I have stands 100y off the fencerow. Mentioned that we will keep passing up the young bucks, but they have found their paradise. No need to even push it further.

 

[Boll Weevil]

A bit different from your neighborhood, but we have lots of large landowners in mine and one thing that's actually helped over the years is information sharing. I totally understand this might not work well in areas where poaching is a concern or with lots of small landowners.

 

[Tallredd]

I'm in Overton County. I have poachers across the street from me. They got busted a few weeks ago shooting deer from the road at night and apparently they can still go hunting. They were there shooting this morning. I agree with the post above, the good ole days of hunting are gone. I'm so frustrated dealing with thermals and road hunting at night, non hunting land owners that don't care what type of criminals they are hosting that i no longer want anything to do with the sport of hunting. Best of luck.

I am originally from Robertson County and worked the Upper Cumberland area as a wildlife biologist for 7 years before changing the "career path". Poaching was an issue then, mostly among high school age kids. By the sound of it from many folks, the issue is still ongoing, which is unfortunate and frustrating. Too bad its just a misdemeanor.

 

[Tallredd]

A bit different from your neighborhood, but we have lots of large landowners in mine and one thing that's actually helped over the years is information sharing. I totally understand this might not work well in areas where poaching is a concern or with lots of small landowners.

Good stuff. It might actually be a good thing in areas with lots of poaching as well. The more outcry from hunters and landowners to the sheriff and/or TWRA the more pressure they're under. You could take it to the local newspaper or something as well. Squeaky wheels get the grease.

 

[Tallredd]

About the only way you are going to get neighbors to focus on habitat is to improve yours to the point where they want to hunt right on your line because you have the best game (because of the habitat improvements you have made).

But that's a downside as well. New group next to one of my farms, and they cram 5 hunters on the 40ac next to me, spaced out on my line every 150y. They have killed 5 already we passed up (3.5 and younger) past week. Won't be long and it will be nigh impossible for any buck in that area to reach 4.5.

I talked with them from a safety standpoint (they have been hunting on our fencerow In areas I have stands 100y off the fencerow. Mentioned that we will keep passing up the young bucks, but they have found their paradise. No need to even push it further.

I have had this happen too. All I'm going to say is that I made good friends with the local barber and he gave me as much hair clippings as I wanted.....

 

[diamond hunter]

Please tell me what the hair clippings does?

 

[Tallredd]

Please tell me what the hair clippings does?

Human scent. I've had people place stands right on our line as well and I just sprinkle the clippings in the areas their stands are in on our side of the line. They cant do anything about it even if they did know what was going on and it did keep the deer away for a number of days after application.

 

[DoubleRidge]

All that to say this....do any of you have any advice or tips to engage the neighborhood landowners and hunters? What has your experience been, if any?

Tallredd..some time ago I tried to start a conversation on here about starting QDM Cooperatives and got little to no response at first then once the conversation got going it was less that motivating...and I understand for some its seems like a pipe dream but in certain circumstances I believe there is an oppurtunity to create Cooperatives and for all involved to see the benefit...will everyone have tbe exact same discipline and management goal? No, but that doesnt mean there is oppurtunity.
So from my personal experiences, and we have a long way to go and allot of work to do, communication and getting to know neighbors has been one of the biggest accomplishment's we've achieved. The largest land owner that borders us has the same management goals and they target older age class bucks. Another bordering land owner will shoot a 2½ or 3½ year old 8pt and be happy. Thats ok. They send me pics of their kill, Ill congratulate them and send them any trail cam pics I may have of their buck....and now I know that buck is not around any longer for the future. Also when we kill a mature buck Ill send them pics and they will be excited. I believe its been educational for them to see and understand whats possible in our area...I dont shove the topic down their throat....but I do bring age class and potential into the conversation in a positive way....now they are sending me trail cam pics asking if a particular buck is mature?...so they are thinking about it now and considering their choices. But absolutely no shaming ever in our conversations...so we have open and honest communication with the largest property owners to each side of us but we still have a few smaller property owners to reach out to....so for starters open and honest communication is key.

 

[Tallredd]

Now that's good stuff. Thank you for the post. Especially the no shaming/talking down part. I'm finding the same to be true and pictures are worth a thousand words. Same goes for trail cam pics. In the other county I hunt it took nearly a decade to get enough people to cooperate and that was before all the trail cameras hit the market and became affordable for everyone. I have a few larger landowners who lease their place out. I need to find a way to contact their hunters just to see if they have a management goal/goals. Communication is definitely key.

 

[DoubleRidge]

Wanted to start a conversation about inspiring folks in our neighborhoods to board the QDM and habitat management train. Not just about deer management but habitat management.

As for a Cooperatives than have habitat management goals...numerous challenges no doubt exsist...but I believe communication and education is key....casually start conversations about habitat projects...share success stories, share your enthusiasm on the topic, help them understand the benifits. There are tons of great videos and publications from top experts such as Dr. Craig Harper, Dr Grant Woods, the Team at MSU deer lab and the list goes on....but share material that opens their mind to a better way to manage closed canopy forest and early successional habitat...introduce them to prescribed fire....educate them on the cost share opportunities that exsist through the NRCS programs...several ways to capture their interest.
Talking about food plots...can a cooperative purchase seed and fertilizer in bulk to bring cost down? Can landowners split the weekend Co-op rental cost of a drill? Can landowers support each other with labor on projects like a controlled burn? Yes...but it takes education, communication and leadership.
One challenge for me personally is one of my neighbors leases the hunting rights so hes limited as to what habitat projects he can do...so now Im in the process of getting to know the owners to see what opportunities may exsist (communication).

 

[DoubleRidge]

And also...it doesnt have to be an "all or nothing" approach...some neighbors may have no interest in the beginning but when they start to see the benifits maybe they will warm up to the idea....and land size shouldnt disqualify anyone...the whole idea is to have more acreage managed better for wildlife in a given area...it all adds up...even if its not bordering, if its in the general area, there could still be collective benefits.

What we shouldnt do is assume our neighbors just dont care about habitat management and that they shoot every buck that walks....many times, after getting to know them, you learn that simply isnt true.