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Patterning Results

Another side note. Back when I was still shooting really bad (only about 3 years ago) I tried Longbeard XRs just to try them. Missed a chip shot or two. Didn't like how tight they were up close. Went back to Double X and then something clicked the following year and I started shooting way better. I still use Double X to this day. Been using them since my first bird when they were called Supreme.
 
Pattern density is not the sole determining factor in CLEANLY taking a bird. The pellets lose energy quickly. Unless you are hunting a field with absolutely nothing between you and the bird, you are going to have quite a few pellets stopped or deflected by brush, limbs or even grass. A standard rule of thumb, no matter what size shot/choke/gun combo you use is 100 pellets in a 10" circle. The farthest distance your gun will do that is your maximum distance the load will create enough pattern density, but not necessarily pellet energy. Most recommendations I have seen is between 2 and 2 1/2 foot lbs of energy to penetrate a vertebra or skull. #5 lead at 1150 fps will run out of this energy between 40-45 yards, and #6s between 38-42 yards. TSS #9s carry the same energy as lead #5s and a lot of hunters think because they have a swarm of a pattern with the little pellets that they should be able to take a turkey at 90 yards. Ain't true, but they do provide hunters with the same pattern density in a lighter 20 gauge gun they used to need a 12 gauge for. So….after all that, try some different shells and chokes. When you can consistently put those 100 pellets in a 10" circle, resign yourself to calling and woodsmanship to get the birds within 40-45 yards and then it's all on your marksmanship skills!
 
Gmed said:
Pattern density is not the sole determining factor in CLEANLY taking a bird. The pellets lose energy quickly. Unless you are hunting a field with absolutely nothing between you and the bird, you are going to have quite a few pellets stopped or deflected by brush, limbs or even grass. A standard rule of thumb, no matter what size shot/choke/gun combo you use is 100 pellets in a 10" circle. The farthest distance your gun will do that is your maximum distance the load will create enough pattern density, but not necessarily pellet energy. Most recommendations I have seen is between 2 and 2 1/2 foot lbs of energy to penetrate a vertebra or skull. #5 lead at 1150 fps will run out of this energy between 40-45 yards, and #6s between 38-42 yards. TSS #9s carry the same energy as lead #5s and a lot of hunters think because they have a swarm of a pattern with the little pellets that they should be able to take a turkey at 90 yards. Ain't true, but they do provide hunters with the same pattern density in a lighter 20 gauge gun they used to need a 12 gauge for. So….after all that, try some different shells and chokes. When you can consistently put those 100 pellets in a 10" circle, resign yourself to calling and woodsmanship to get the birds within 40-45 yards and then it's all on your marksmanship skills!
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Keep in mind that TSS #9s are denser and therefore smaller in diameter than lead 5s, which is why they are 9s not 5s. They won't slow down as quick with less air resistance from the smaller size.

But that really does not matter. If you're shooting at birds so far that you have to question the energy of lead 5s or 6s, or TSS 9s, you're missing the point of turkey hunting. They are a bird that is called up, stalked, or decoyed, and shot with a shotgun, occasionally with a bow. It's about getting them close, not seeing how far you can hit one.

Keep it simple. Shoot your paper target, see how the pattern looks. If it's not good enough, try a different load or choke. Don't overthink all the technical stuff. In the end a dead turkey is a dead turkey.
 
catman529 said:
Keep in mind that TSS #9s are denser and therefore smaller in diameter than lead 5s, which is why they are 9s not 5s. They won't slow down as quick with less air resistance from the smaller size.

But that really does not matter. If you're shooting at birds so far that you have to question the energy of lead 5s or 6s, or TSS 9s, you're missing the point of turkey hunting. They are a bird that is called up, stalked, or decoyed, and shot with a shotgun, occasionally with a bow. It's about getting them close, not seeing how far you can hit one.

Keep it simple. Shoot your paper target, see how the pattern looks. If it's not good enough, try a different load or choke. Don't overthink all the technical stuff. In the end a dead turkey is a dead turkey.
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Absolutely. That's what I meant when I said resign yourself to your woodsmanship and calling and get em within 40-45…
 
UTGrad said:
Let me try this again. I posted the 60 yard sheet.

Here is pattern at 40
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I'm willing to bet you have a good pattern, but the densest part is off target. Shoot a big piece of paper and see what happens.

I had to adjust my sight picture because when aiming like a rifle, my patterns were low and to the left. The gun's LOP was too short to aim it with none of the rib showing. But when I take the approach of "floating the bird" with the rib visible to me when aiming my shotgun (I'd say 80% of target above the bead, 20% covered by it), everything above the bead is dense pattern, and it gets sparse quick beneath it. But I wouldn't have known that if I just shot at "turkey targets" while patterning.

Killed more ducks this season than last when I changed my sight picture, too.
 
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Have you tried #6 in the Long beard?
Reason I ask is I shot 5's for years in a Benelli with a .660 comp n choke. I swapped on a whim and it gets a much better pattern.
I still use the gun fro time to time but, I'm primarily a .410 guy now.
 
3.5" # 6 2oz Longbeard XR 40 yards
 

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Pattern density is more than adequate at 40y... did you pull that shot? Center of pattern seems to be about 4inches to the left and a couple low however (esp compared to 25y pattern... which is dead on the money).

And while the pattern density is fine at 40y at the center of that pattern, what actually hit the point of aim is borderline.
 
megalomaniac said:
did you pull that shot? Center of pattern seems to be about 4inches to the left and a couple low however (esp compared to 25y pattern... which is dead on the money).

And while the pattern density is fine at 40y at the center of that pattern, what actually hit the point of aim is borderline.
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Yes. There's no pellets to the right of the turkey head. Make sure you are mounting your gun the same way. But it looks like POA/POI is good!

Nice thing is, it does not appear you'll have to fiddle with sight picture or worse yet, "Kentucky windage."
 
megalomaniac said:
Pattern density is more than adequate at 40y... did you pull that shot? Center of pattern seems to be about 4inches to the left and a couple low however (esp compared to 25y pattern... which is dead on the money).

And while the pattern density is fine at 40y at the center of that pattern, what actually hit the point of aim is borderline.
Click to expand...

This might be a better look. Same shot just on the large backing paper to see the whole story. Might have pulled it a tad but correct me if I'm wrong but I see a lot of pellets in the bird here.

40 yards will be max cause of #6 shot and KE beyond 40 being low.
 

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You might want to look into some good adjustable sights as well. That can be a game changer. I've got Williams fire sights on the Benelli I mentioned in my earlier post.
They are fully adjustable for windage and elevation. You'd be surprised how point of impact and point of aim with a shot gun is sometimes crazy off, but, once dialed in , it's like shooting a rifle out to a point.
Not to brag, I shot a gobbler once that had stuck his head up over a berm in a fire break. It was about 12 steps from my short legs and it about took his head off. Only thing holding it on was about an 1/8" of skin. That gun is dialed in. I've killed them at 60 in gas line right of ways as well.
We all know it take time and $ when you start patterning turkey guns. Ol Gobbler .com can help you too. There's a link that has patterns and loads from different guns/choke combinations that can help save some sanity and maybe a little $.
 
Stumpsitter said:
You might want to look into some good adjustable sights as well. That can be a game changer. I've got Williams fire sights on the Benelli I mentioned in my earlier post.
They are fully adjustable for windage and elevation. You'd be surprised how point of impact and point of aim with a shot gun is sometimes crazy off, but, once dialed in , it's like shooting a rifle out to a point.
Not to brag, I shot a gobbler once that had stuck his head up over a berm in a fire break. It was about 12 steps from my short legs and it about took his head off. Only thing holding it on was about an 1/8" of skin. That gun is dialed in. I've killed them at 60 in gas line right of ways as well.
We all know it take time and $ when you start patterning turkey guns. Ol Gobbler .com can help you too. There's a link that has patterns and loads from different guns/choke combinations that can help save some sanity and maybe a little $.
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Thank you. I've got a Nikon Monarch 1.5-4x20 scope on this shotgun. It's 1/2 MOA reticle adjustments and was able to dial it in. My 870 I put a Hi Vis front and rear fiber optic sight that attaches to the rib.
 
UTGrad said:
This might be a better look. Same shot just on the large backing paper to see the whole story. Might have pulled it a tad but correct me if I'm wrong but I see a lot of pellets in the bird here.

40 yards will be max cause of #6 shot and KE beyond 40 being low.
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The center of that pattern is about 3in to the left and 4in low from your point of aim. Nothing is escaping the center. Where you hit will kill one 70% of the time or so.
 
megalomaniac said:
The center of that pattern is about 3in to the left and 4in low from your point of aim. Nothing is escaping the center. Where you hit will kill one 70% of the time or so.
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I might shoot a couple more shells this weekend and see if I pulled that one. My 25 yard group same shell was pretty much dead on.

Thank you for the help.
 
UTGrad said:
I've got a Nikon Monarch 1.5-4x20 scope on this shotgun.
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I use that same exact scope on my 12ga turkey gun; and am about to replace the Fastfire on the 20 with another Monarch. Actually, I believe it's 1.5-4.5x20mm.

This particular scope is also an excellent "woods" scope for any deer gun as well.
Despite it's small 20mm objective, and small size, light-gathering ability is superb at dusk & dawn.

Wish they still made these particular scopes.
Both mine also have a camo finish, making them look even cooler on a turkey gun.
 

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