Reduced limit ?

[Bone Collector]

Definitely think the limit should be different for turkeys by region or county.

Good example with the deer limit it's 3 a day in unit L. Virtually unlimited... But is the deer population decimated? No because most CAN'T and WONT kill that many...

One of my points is that might be the same with turkeys. It won't change much because most people CANT kill 4 anyways...

Look at quail you can kill 6 a day!!!? Think that has any matter on the population?

Something to think about..

I do not think this idea will work. I started hunting turkeys in 2010 and easily limited out on the same WMA for the first 3 seasons (I couldn't hunt in 2012 for personal reasons). I had more private land by 2014 and still easily limited out for a couple more seasons. As an FYI I didn't even know how to call turkeys, i just bushwhacked them. In 2015 I started learning more about turkeys, calling them and hunting them. It is way more fun to kill one by calling it in and just win the game. Doing so with no decoys is just icing on the cake. That being said, the WMA I used to limit out on easily, still has turkeys, but no where near what it used to have. The main reason is over killing. Most people can't kill 4 anymore no matter where they hunt, because they can't find 4 to kill, because they aren't there anymore. The folks that have healthy populations on several farms, limit out, sometimes regardless of their skill level. The folks that do not have birds anymore do not, also regardless of their skill level.

I rarely hunt deer with a firearm on WMAs anymore, but when I have I have noticed there is a influx of E. TN hunters here in Unit L killing deer, because they can't shoot does, in E. TN at that time or there just aren't as many deer. Get where this going? Making limits by county, zones or what have you will only bring people from the low limit areas to the high limit areas to hunt.

I don't disagree the reduced limit may help but I fear it might be all for naught... And if the population rebounds I doubt they will raise it back... Just hate to see us lose any more freedoms in this country...

The only thing that the TWRA or TWRC can control is the # of birds we can shoot. The issue with no lowering the limit by law is that if 20% of turkey hunters self limit, and 80% do not, it will be all for naught, so it has to be an imposed limit. I mention this because eventually someone will comment, "If you guys care so much, just self limit..." Remember deer limits have gone up and down many times in the last 30 years or so. Nothing saying if they lowered it to 2 for a few years that we couldn't walk back up to 3.

Yes I agree where is this going!? States like AR reducing OOS days on WMA's for NR for ducks. States reducing limits, dates and tags for NR. TN looking to reduce limits and days we can hunt!

I rarely hunt public but the only bird I've killed this season came off a heavily pressured WMA. I know farms close by that don't get a fraction of the pressure that have far fewer birds than they used too. One of them even larger than the WMA.. Actually the only gobbler I've seen since last Tuesday was on this WMA as I was just driving by and I've hunted everyday.. So I don't believe the pressure is the underlying issue....

Next crappie fisherman will be up in arms to reduce the crappie limit because of all the turkey hunters fishing! All brought to you by turkey HUNTERS! Where is this going!? I like fishing too but I'd rather hunt!

I think your missing my point. I know there are many factors that play into the decline, but limits and season dates are really all we can control.

Either the TWRA has to open more predator trapping/hunting opportunities (perhaps with bounties) or lower hunting limits and season lengths.


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[Bgoodman30]

Definitely think the limit should be different for turkeys by region or county.

Good example with the deer limit it's 3 a day in unit L. Virtually unlimited... But is the deer population decimated? No because most CAN'T and WONT kill that many...

One of my points is that might be the same with turkeys. It won't change much because most people CANT kill 4 anyways...

Look at quail you can kill 6 a day!!!? Think that has any matter on the population?

Something to think about..

I do not think this idea will work. I started hunting turkeys in 2010 and easily limited out on the same WMA for the first 3 seasons (I couldn't hunt in 2012 for personal reasons). I had more private land by 2014 and still easily limited out for a couple more seasons. As an FYI I didn't even know how to call turkeys, i just bushwhacked them. In 2015 I started learning more about turkeys, calling them and hunting them. It is way more fun to kill one by calling it in and just win the game. Doing so with no decoys is just icing on the cake. That being said, the WMA I used to limit out on easily, still has turkeys, but no where near what it used to have. The main reason is over killing. Most people can't kill 4 anymore no matter where they hunt, because they can't find 4 to kill, because they aren't there anymore. The folks that have healthy populations on several farms, limit out, sometimes regardless of their skill level. The folks that do not have birds anymore do not, also regardless of their skill level.

I rarely hunt deer with a firearm on WMAs anymore, but when I have I have noticed there is a influx of E. TN hunters here in Unit L killing deer, because they can't shoot does, in E. TN at that time or there just aren't as many deer. Get where this going? Making limits by county, zones or what have you will only bring people from the low limit areas to the high limit areas to hunt.

I don't disagree the reduced limit may help but I fear it might be all for naught... And if the population rebounds I doubt they will raise it back... Just hate to see us lose any more freedoms in this country...

The only thing that the TWRA or TWRC can control is the # of birds we can shoot. The issue with no lowering the limit by law is that if 20% of turkey hunters self limit, and 80% do not, it will be all for naught, so it has to be an imposed limit. I mention this because eventually someone will comment, "If you guys care so much, just self limit..." Remember deer limits have gone up and down many times in the last 30 years or so. Nothing saying if they lowered it to 2 for a few years that we couldn't walk back up to 3.

Yes I agree where is this going!? States like AR reducing OOS days on WMA's for NR for ducks. States reducing limits, dates and tags for NR. TN looking to reduce limits and days we can hunt!

I rarely hunt public but the only bird I've killed this season came off a heavily pressured WMA. I know farms close by that don't get a fraction of the pressure that have far fewer birds than they used too. One of them even larger than the WMA.. Actually the only gobbler I've seen since last Tuesday was on this WMA as I was just driving by and I've hunted everyday.. So I don't believe the pressure is the underlying issue....

Next crappie fisherman will be up in arms to reduce the crappie limit because of all the turkey hunters fishing! All brought to you by turkey HUNTERS! Where is this going!? I like fishing too but I'd rather hunt!

I think your missing my point. I know there are many factors that play into the decline, but limits and season dates are really all we can control.

Either the TWRA has to open more predator trapping/hunting opportunities (perhaps with bounties) or lower hunting limits and season lengths.


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I'm all for the TWRA predator control efforts but without fur prices I think we're in trouble... A bounty is a great idea but can TWRA afford it? Maybe coon hunting will have a resurgence one day but I doubt it...?

I agree that some limit reductions or later opening may help marginally but I think it might be a feel good strategy. I want proof from other state agencies that reducing the limit has proven to restore populations and hunter success? Most folks only kill 2 or less anyways so what changes other than punishing the avid hunters...?


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[megalomaniac]

The reason for a limit reduction is not a 'punishment', but rather a statement to the hunting public that the resource is not sustainable under current management strategies. Same way with season opening dates (which are far more crucial). It sucks to have 2 weeks of season taken away if opening dates are pushed back by 2 weeks (which is what I feel is absolutely necessary to for turkeys to continue as a renewable resource), but if it allows us to have a huntable population for the rest of my lifetime, its worth it.

I've never killed 4 birds in TN in a single year since the limit was increased to 4 (easy to do, but my farms could not handle that year after year), but I'm seriously thinking about spending half of my TN time on public land and killing my 4, 'but just spreading them out across the state, so its OK'

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[Bgoodman30]

The reason for a limit reduction is not a 'punishment', but rather a statement to the hunting public that the resource is not sustainable under current management strategies. Same way with season opening dates (which are far more crucial). It sucks to have 2 weeks of season taken away if opening dates are pushed back by 2 weeks (which is what I feel is absolutely necessary to for turkeys to continue as a renewable resource), but if it allows us to have a huntable population for the rest of my lifetime, its worth it.

I've never killed 4 birds in TN in a single year since the limit was increased to 4 (easy to do, but my farms could not handle that year after year), but I'm seriously thinking about spending half of my TN time on public land and killing my 4, 'but just spreading them out across the state, so its OK'

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I agree whatever works to provide the opportunities for my children will be worth it but only if it works! I am not looking for "statements" but solutions! I am afraid some of these solutions may not be economically feasible... Idk maybe fur makes a resurgence and coon pelts prices increase?

I also agree pushing the season dates back will be the most help for breeding success IMO.. I think one week would be a good start. This will also decrease those reaching the limit of 4 so again wouldn't help much..


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[prstide]

Lower limit based upon zones to keep the Region 2 hunters happy until those areas experience what other parts of the state already have then they will understand and stop with the questioning, ban full fan decoys(possibly all decoys but from my personal experience I haven't been successful using them except for field birds on occasion), push the season back 2 weeks minimum, and no NR hunters until after 2 weeks of the season for residents.
A good place to start with a path toward success on season/limit changes would be the South Carolina Turkey Management report that was posted several months ago. Use that and what has been commented about ad nauseam to enlighten yourself and gain understanding of things like when you kill all the dominant breeders in the first 2 weeks of the season it leads to population decline because the order of dominance isn't quickly reestablished and leads to many hens being unbred. That doesn't even include all the natural hurdles that effect nesting success and poult recruitment on a yearly basis. Also take into account that there haven't been detailed surveys done in our state regarding nesting success or poult recruitment to base the asinine limits on to begin with. Why it hasn't been taken to zones the way deer hunting was years ago is just lazy on TFWC/TWRA. To say that "avid (Turkey)hunters" would feel punished by lowering the season limit speaks so loudly I can't even hear what you're saying. I think true avid turkey hunters are respectful of the resource, want to continue to be able to do what they love to do every spring for the foreseeable future, and would completely understand that lowering limits to achieve that(along with other changes) is the right thing to do.

 

[TheLBLman]

The reason for a limit reduction is not a 'punishment', but rather a statement to the hunting public that the resource is not sustainable under current management strategies.
Same way with season opening dates (which are far more crucial).

Exactly right.

Those stating "I only kill my 4 birds across several farms, spread them out," are only kidding themselves, or rationalizing.

Turkeys have a larger "range" than many people want to accept.

For every accomplished hunter making the "spread out the kills" statement,
there's another one much like him, both unbeknownst to each other, both limiting out on the same area's turkey populations,
Often, it's several hunters in an area doing this, not just one or two who don't know about each other.

From a practical standpoint, TWRA must do something "practical" and reasonably "enforceable".

Just to "keep it simple" . . . . .

Best thing TWRA could do is start opening our turkey season on the 2nd Saturday of April
and go to a 2-bird limit.

This change would insure our turkey season never opens any earlier than April 8th,
and would "on average" mean our turkey season opens about 10 days later in the future
than it has for the past few decades (of Saturday closest to April 1st, which was often in March).

 

[Bgoodman30]

Lower limit based upon zones to keep the Region 2 hunters happy until those areas experience what other parts of the state already have then they will understand and stop with the questioning, ban full fan decoys(possibly all decoys but from my personal experience I haven't been successful using them except for field birds on occasion), push the season back 2 weeks minimum, and no NR hunters until after 2 weeks of the season for residents.
A good place to start with a path toward success on season/limit changes would be the South Carolina Turkey Management report that was posted several months ago. Use that and what has been commented about ad nauseam to enlighten yourself and gain understanding of things like when you kill all the dominant breeders in the first 2 weeks of the season it leads to population decline because the order of dominance isn't quickly reestablished and leads to many hens being unbred. That doesn't even include all the natural hurdles that effect nesting success and poult recruitment on a yearly basis. Also take into account that there haven't been detailed surveys done in our state regarding nesting success or poult recruitment to base the asinine limits on to begin with. Why it hasn't been taken to zones the way deer hunting was years ago is just lazy on TFWC/TWRA. To say that "avid (Turkey)hunters" would feel punished by lowering the season limit speaks so loudly I can't even hear what you're saying. I think true avid turkey hunters are respectful of the resource, want to continue to be able to do what they love to do every spring for the foreseeable future, and would completely understand that lowering limits to achieve that(along with other changes) is the right thing to do.

Yeah I'm an avid hunter I like to hunt I want to have a spring season last longer than a few days. No apologies for that! I spread my kills out over several farms and public. Usually 3- 4 counties!Yes I'm very respectful of the resource there are plenty more turkeys when I leave... I own a farm under the WHIP and took up trapping this season.. I am more concerned with poults and nest success because I believe that is the answer not limits... Take Maury county for example it's usually in the top for harvest with many dominant birds taken during youth and first couple weeks of season but continues to reload! It's really the only county I hunt that I feel only has a slight decline..

Pushing season back and switch to zone/ region limits is what I support even though I don't believe any limit reductions will bring populations back... Limit reductions would naturally happen and would not really by necessary imo. Also would also see support the fan ban. I have used it successfully in the past a few times but have left it in the truck this season...


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[megalomaniac]

Lower limit based upon zones to keep the Region 2 hunters happy until those areas experience what other parts of the state already have then they will understand and stop with the questioning, ban full fan decoys(possibly all decoys but from my personal experience I haven't been successful using them except for field birds on occasion), push the season back 2 weeks minimum, and no NR hunters until after 2 weeks of the season for residents.
A good place to start with a path toward success on season/limit changes would be the South Carolina Turkey Management report that was posted several months ago. Use that and what has been commented about ad nauseam to enlighten yourself and gain understanding of things like when you kill all the dominant breeders in the first 2 weeks of the season it leads to population decline because the order of dominance isn't quickly reestablished and leads to many hens being unbred. That doesn't even include all the natural hurdles that effect nesting success and poult recruitment on a yearly basis. Also take into account that there haven't been detailed surveys done in our state regarding nesting success or poult recruitment to base the asinine limits on to begin with. Why it hasn't been taken to zones the way deer hunting was years ago is just lazy on TFWC/TWRA. To say that "avid (Turkey)hunters" would feel punished by lowering the season limit speaks so loudly I can't even hear what you're saying. I think true avid turkey hunters are respectful of the resource, want to continue to be able to do what they love to do every spring for the foreseeable future, and would completely understand that lowering limits to achieve that(along with other changes) is the right thing to do.

I love all of this! Except you are not keeping me off my farms I pay taxes on even though I am a nonresident

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[Bgoodman30]

The reason for a limit reduction is not a 'punishment', but rather a statement to the hunting public that the resource is not sustainable under current management strategies.
Same way with season opening dates (which are far more crucial).

Exactly right.

Those stating "I only kill my 4 birds across several farms, spread them out," are only kidding themselves, or rationalizing.

Turkeys have a larger "range" than many people want to accept.

For every accomplished hunter making the "spread out the kills" statement,
there's another one much like him, both unbeknownst to each other, both limiting out on the same area's turkey populations,
Often, it's several hunters in an area doing this, not just one or two who don't know about each other.

From a practical standpoint, TWRA must do something "practical" and reasonably "enforceable".

Just to "keep it simple" . . . . .

Best thing TWRA could do is start opening our turkey season on the 2nd Saturday of April
and go to a 2-bird limit.

This change would insure our turkey season never opens any earlier than April 8th,
and would "on average" mean our turkey season opens about 10 days later in the future
than it has for the past few decades (of Saturday closest to April 1st, which was often in March).

I know turkeys have a huge range in the fall/winter but in my observation during spring season they usually stay pretty tight..

Your spread out kills statement between other hunters makes perfect sense but probably again marginal because so few hunters actually reach the limit.. On my private farms it seems most turkeys we don't kill survive which I certainly can't say that about our deer...


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[Bgoodman30]

Also would like TN to go to paper tags for purchase like in many states. Your BG license gets you 2 tags and additional tags must be purchased separately. Extra dollars from tag sales go directly to turkey conservation efforts.


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[Setterman]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

 

[Bgoodman30]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

You hunt hardwoods only correct?


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[prstide]

Lower limit based upon zones to keep the Region 2 hunters happy until those areas experience what other parts of the state already have then they will understand and stop with the questioning, ban full fan decoys(possibly all decoys but from my personal experience I haven't been successful using them except for field birds on occasion), push the season back 2 weeks minimum, and no NR hunters until after 2 weeks of the season for residents.
A good place to start with a path toward success on season/limit changes would be the South Carolina Turkey Management report that was posted several months ago. Use that and what has been commented about ad nauseam to enlighten yourself and gain understanding of things like when you kill all the dominant breeders in the first 2 weeks of the season it leads to population decline because the order of dominance isn't quickly reestablished and leads to many hens being unbred. That doesn't even include all the natural hurdles that effect nesting success and poult recruitment on a yearly basis. Also take into account that there haven't been detailed surveys done in our state regarding nesting success or poult recruitment to base the asinine limits on to begin with. Why it hasn't been taken to zones the way deer hunting was years ago is just lazy on TFWC/TWRA. To say that "avid (Turkey)hunters" would feel punished by lowering the season limit speaks so loudly I can't even hear what you're saying. I think true avid turkey hunters are respectful of the resource, want to continue to be able to do what they love to do every spring for the foreseeable future, and would completely understand that lowering limits to achieve that(along with other changes) is the right thing to do.

I love all of this! Except you are not keeping me off my farms I pay taxes on even though I am a nonresident

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Apologies!! :lol: Taxpayers are an exception. All these idiots flocking in from all over to hunt public land is what I was aiming that at. NR private land is a different story!

 

[prstide]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

I agree but would still rather be safe than sorry to help ease the early season non-resident pressure on public lands by lowering the limits too.

 

[Setterman]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

I agree but would still rather be safe than sorry to help ease the early season non-resident pressure on public lands by lowering the limits too.

Oh make no mistake I've got no problem with reducing the limit and have been banging the drum since they stupidly raised it to 4 birds.

 

[Setterman]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

You hunt hardwoods only correct?


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Nope. Here in hunt a lot of reclaimed strip mines, sure there's some woods but also plenty of open ground.

I also have spent decades hunting southern crop field birds that never leave fields except to roost.

No reason for the crutch that are decoys except to allow the inept hunters to have success. No surer sign of a googan, rube, inept hunter than a sack of decoys. Any hunter worth a flip doesn't need them to have success.

Outlawing decoys would save thousands and thousands of gobblers each spring

 

[Bgoodman30]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

You hunt hardwoods only correct?


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Nope. Here in hunt a lot of reclaimed strip mines, sure there's some woods but also plenty of open ground.

I also have spent decades hunting southern crop field birds that never leave fields except to roost.

No reason for the crutch that are decoys except to allow the inept hunters to have success. No surer sign of a googan, rube, inept hunter than a sack of decoys. Any hunter worth a flip doesn't need them to have success.

Outlawing decoys would save thousands and thousands of gobblers each spring

A little extreme I think. I would be more accepting of this than limit reductions in R2.. Although I like them for youth season.

Would be all for ban of gobbler decoys and fan ban.


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[Setterman]

Good point, and I would be fine with hen decoys still being legal. It's the male decoys and fans that are the issues

 

[catman529]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

You hunt hardwoods only correct?


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I can't speak for Setterman but I know where you're going. Field birds are tough. I've killed a few and been frustrated by many. I don't use decoys. I've gotten good enough that I can kill a few and not ever want to use a decoy. And I'm not that great, just persistent. I can't say I would support banning decoys, but I wouldn't be against it either. As it stands, a 2 bird limit doesn't look so bad right now. But, I love to kill 4 birds in TN. If banning decoys, just strutter decoys and fanning, would help the population without lowering the limit, I'd be in favor of it. Maybe this coronavirus and all the people off work has my view skewed a little, but regardless, turkey hunting and especially public land hunting seems to be getting much more popular, and we need to protect the resource.


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[poorhunter]

Leave the limit at 4 but outlaw decoys. The decoy googans won't stand a chance and therefore the limit won't matter.

You hunt hardwoods only correct?


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Nope. Here in hunt a lot of reclaimed strip mines, sure there's some woods but also plenty of open ground.

I also have spent decades hunting southern crop field birds that never leave fields except to roost.

No reason for the crutch that are decoys except to allow the inept hunters to have success. No surer sign of a googan, rube, inept hunter than a sack of decoys. Any hunter worth a flip doesn't need them to have success.

Outlawing decoys would save thousands and thousands of gobblers each spring

Couldn't agree more. It's not that decoys work every time, but they work extremely well on field birds that would more often than not live most if not all the season and breed tons of hens. In the first two weeks of the season what percentage of birds killed are killed with decoys? 25%? 50%?