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Scope vs Red dot

Granddaddy said:
Have never seen the need for a scope or red dot on a shotgun. I've come to appreciate a red dot/green dot on my ARs & pistols. But turkey hunting, too much chance of knocking the sight off line, battery dying or some other malfunction, etc IMO. A good fiber optics front sight more reliable & just as effective in all lighting conditions.
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Something to be said for this. I've shot plain bead, rifle sights, and fastfire. If for some reason I could not use the fastfire, I would go back to a plain bead.

But that said, I've patterned a lot of guns. When choked down enough to get a discernible pattern, on more than half the center of the pattern does not hit centered with the point of aim. Some part of the pattern almost always covers the point of aim, but it might be the left or right half of your pattern doing the killing every time. In practice, that's usually not a big deal. It's a shotgun. As long as some part of your pattern covers his head, he'll be just as dead. But I'm a little OCD. If I'm aiming at his neck, I want the center of my pattern to him him in the neck. That ensures a little wiggle room if he zigs or I zag when the shot is touched off. Often the only way to get that without specialized gunsmithing barrel work is to use some form of adjustable sight.
 
Reflex red dot all the way for me. I prefer the vortex venom.

Millions of pros to it, one really, really annoying con... when it gets wet, the dot becomes a starburst and it is almost impossible to use. Have to remember to dry the glass off before the bird comes in. A tube scope is less affected by moisture. Bead sights are completely unaffected by moisture.

I use a saddle mount on one of my turkey guns when it is going to be pouring rain. If I cant use the red dot, I've got iron bead for backup.

My other turkey gun has been drilled and tapped for a picatinny rail for a reflex red dot. I much prefer it, as it sits lower on the barrel... but I have to keep the glass dry on the reflex sight.
 
In my opinion, the tube type red-dots and scopes are mounted too high for a shotgun. I do have a FF3 on my 410 turkey gun and really like it. The only reason for the FF3 is the very tight pattern from the 410 leaves very little margin for error at close range. I will say that 2 years ago, I called in a nice Tom for a friend that had a scope on his Benelli. We were partially looking into the sun the way the bird came in and for whatever reason, just as the bird was approaching shooting distance, we got the "puck!" and he was gone. I know I hadn't moved and I don't think my buddy had and I have always suspected glare off the scope. IDK for sure because those things happen, but I've always been leery of a setup looking into the sun like that. I wear glasses and have known for years that I have to get anti-reflective coatings and keep my head down.
 
I've used a couple different tube style scopes over the years and the last was a Pentax Lightseeker SG with the turkey plex reticle. Had it on a Mossberg 835 and then a Remington 870 and really liked it. Bought a Winchester SX3 and only using fiber optics on it. If I went to something else it would be the Burris FF3 or similar but for now sticking with fiber optics.
 
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I killed lots of turkeys out to 40-50 yards with just the bead on my 870 Super Magnum. Then, I noticed the eyes weren't as good as they used to be, and getting the bead on a bird's head was more difficult. Around that same time, I friends had battery powered dots. And I watched them fail. Battery dead. Dot became unusable in the rain. Or some other technical glitch that caused them to miss.

Anyway, I settled on a Simmons fixed 4X shotgun scope, the same one I have on my MLs. It has enough eye relief that it doesn't slam my forehead with the 3-1/2" loads. I mounted it with the B-square mount and rings that raised it above the rib. I thought the 4X might be too much, but haven't had any issues with it. By mounting it off the rib, I can use the bead on a 20 yard shot.

No batteries to go dead. Nothing to blur in the rain. No switch to have to remember to turn on. And a backup bead if I need it.
 
I think its depends on the type of Shotgun you use. I have a Savage 220 and it mounts more like a rifle which works better for me because I'm not a shotgunner ,I have a regular scope on this set up and it works great. For a normal shotgun the low profile Reflex sight works best IMO.
 
I actually "prefer" a traditional scope as well, but for a lightweight "run & gun" set-up, the tiny 1.5 oz Burris Fastfire gets my vote.

My heavy, very heavy, 12-ga dedicated turkey gun is topped with a Nikon Monarch 1.5x shotgun scope, and I absolutely love that scope for turkey hunting.

But when I can do real "traditional" turkey hunting, walking, more like running, over miles of territory in a day, I'd rather carry my little super-light 20 ga dedicated turkey killer, topped with a 1.5 oz Burris Fastfire. This setup weighs barely over half as much as the 12 ga, and it's almost like carrying no gun at all, by comparison.
 
megalomaniac said:
Reflex red dot all the way for me. I prefer the vortex venom.

Millions of pros to it, one really, really annoying con... when it gets wet, the dot becomes a starburst and it is almost impossible to use. Have to remember to dry the glass off before the bird comes in. A tube scope is less affected by moisture. Bead sights are completely unaffected by moisture.

I use a saddle mount on one of my turkey guns when it is going to be pouring rain. If I cant use the red dot, I've got iron bead for backup.

My other turkey gun has been drilled and tapped for a picatinny rail for a reflex red dot. I much prefer it, as it sits lower on the barrel... but I have to keep the glass dry on the reflex sight.
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I got a simple solution for this I don't hunt in the rain lol. Seriously though I hate the rain with a passion and want nothing to do with it. I hunt public land and if I can beat the rain in I will carry a small pop up blind in and set up in it. But I am not sitting on the ground or in a treestand and getting soaked anymore while doing any type of hunting. Whether it's deer or turkey. I am fine with 6° temps or snow. Sorry didn't mean to hijack the thread and start talking about weather.

I agree on the red dots accuracy I have a FF3 and a Venom one on my 835 and one on my 535 and I would buy both of them again in a heartbeat. Greatly improved poa/poi. You are able to fine tune your shots which is great with today's loads and chokes. Looking to get a 20 gauge and will probably throw another Venom or FF3 on it. I know Burris is coming out with the FF4 soon but I will give it about a year before I buy one and see the reviews in case any bugs need to be worked out and wait for the price point to come down before I purchase one. Happy and safe hunting guys.
 
I use a eotech and really like it, no matter the angle just put that dot on his head and then your boot...
 
Rakkin6 said:
I have a Burris FF3 on my 835 and a Vortex venom on my 535. Love them both, they are low profile, lightweight and they both have long battery life. Never had any issues with either of them. They both have stood up to shooting 12 gauge 3" Winchester Longbeards XR shells without losing zero.
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I have the same Burris on the 835, also, but shooting 3.5s.
That sight takes an absolute BEATING with that load, but never fails.
Highly recommend.
 
LanceS4803 said:
I have the same Burris on the 835, also, but shooting 3.5s.
That sight takes an absolute BEATING with that load, but never fails.
Highly recommend.
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Better man than me, shot some 3.5" shells and I was like nah going to just shoot the 3" and call it good lol.
 
Rakkin6 said:
I got a simple solution for this I don't hunt in the rain lol. Seriously though I hate the rain with a passion and want nothing to do with it. I am not sitting on the ground or in a treestand and getting soaked anymore while doing any type of hunting. Whether it's deer or turkey. I am fine with 6° temps or snow.
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Me and you both! I bought a $300 rain suit 6 or 7 years ago and I can count the times I've worn it on one hand. And those times were on out of state trips where I had limited days to hunt. I set a ground blind up on my food plot and leave it all season. If it's raining I'll walk in with an umbrella and sit in the blind. I do enjoy hunting when it's raining, but I'm staying dry.
 
Rakkin6 said:
Better man than me, shot some 3.5" shells and I was like nah going to just shoot the 3" and call it good lol.
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:D
It started with not being able to find 3 inchers! I just stuck with them. (Now all I can find are 3s)
There is a guy at work we call Mongo, which should tell you his size. He stopped by the range and tried one shot, put it back down on the table and said, "Nope."
I'm not a member of the He-Man Chest Club, so wear a PAST shooting pad, but it still hits harder than anything I have, to include a 375 Ruger.
 
LanceS4803 said:
:D
It started with not being able to find 3 inchers! I just stuck with them. (Now all I can find are 3s)
There is a guy at work we call Mongo, which should tell you his size. He stopped by the range and tried one shot, put it back down on the table and said, "Nope."
I'm not a member of the He-Man Chest Club, so wear a PAST shooting pad, but it still hits harder than anything I have, to include a 375 Ruger.
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Yeah the first time I shot them was out of my 535 which has a pretty good kick with 3" shells. Plus it is a super light gun at 6.75 pounds. So when I pulled that trigger on those 3.5" it is a really good kick. Now if I couldn't find 3" shells I would definitely shoot some 3.5" shells. But would definitely have a slip on recoil pad and maybe a shooters shoulder pad to pattern them.
 

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