• Help Support TNDeer:

Big changes from the meeting today

If they only pushed the season back two weeks I would be fine. Two bird limit is fine with me too, although I don't think it is necessary with the date change. We should all be controlling nest raiders as best we can anyway too. I am not convinced that raptors are decimating turkey populations whatsoever, even though they do kill and eat them. Nest raiders, rain and unbred hens are the problems, along with disease. When disease comes through a population, all these other factors become exponentially more of a problem and it takes a longer time for the resource to recover. We have to stop feeding corn in Tennessee.
 
KPH said:
Guess if I shoot one jake the next time when I call one in I will have to measure his beard before I shoot him. Going to be birds not turned in. Now I don't mind them moving the season back or going to only two birds.
Click to expand...
agreed. a lot of ground checking going to happen. I have no problem with the two bird limit
 
megalomaniac said:
Summary...

Bill Cox lives to fan and defends it with the argument that those who are opposed to it are just overly 'emotional'.

Only reason limit was dropped from 3 bird to 2 was so adults could kill jakes. Bill Cox and Ripley cannot tell the difference between an adult bird and a jake.

But thank goodness.... the ONE thing that may make a difference is pushing season back 2 weeks.

And surprisingly, TWRA themselves as an agency were pretty proactive in recommending and supporting the major reg changes. This is the first time in a decade and a half that a little bit of faith in TWRA has been restored.when it comes to turkeys.
Click to expand...

Is this true? Can they really not tell the difference in a jake and gobbler??
 
Using 2021 data, which I believe to be reflective of most years as a %, approx. 91,000 youth/adult turkey hunters entered the woods and killed approx. 52,000 turkeys. According to the sample study "57% of adult hunters and 46% of youth hunters harvested at least one turkey during the 2021 spring turkey season. Among all successful adult hunters, 61% reported harvesting only one bird, 25% reported exactly two birds, and the remaining 15% reported three birds."

The number of hunters harvesting 2 or more that hunted public land exclusively was less. Those that hunted public/private fell in that average range posted above with exclusively private hunters being above the average.

The reduction in bag limit is only going to save about 15% of total kills from a purely basic view point, I don't know how many hunters killed jakes but in 2021 approx. 5,000 were killed. The reduction may or may not save them, I suspect it will because people are actually going to have to hunt turkeys now instead of pop shooting them, although the number saved might be irrelevant in the grand scheme, idk(maybe more site specific).

I think the reduction in the limit will have more of a psychological impact on hunters vs biological impact on turkeys. I think the delayed opener will of course be beneficial and add to that the tighten of the screws on public lands and it might keep some of the blood thirsty wanna be influencers away from our great state.
 
Personally I don't care for the delayed opening. Those hunting the later part will be flushing hens off the nest.
I have no problem with 2 bird limit but saving the gobblers ain't the problem. Protect the hens and nesting areas. They will get bred even with minimal gobblers. More successful nests means more future gobblers.
Just my 2 cents
 
woodsman04 said:
Is this true? Can they really not tell the difference in a jake and gobbler??
Click to expand...
Bill Cox literally said how can someone tell if a beard is 6 inches or not? When TWRA explained to him that beard length was only one requirement differentiating an adult from a juvenile (the other criteria being at least 1 spur 1/2 in or greater, a full fan, and primary wing feathers with barring extending to the end of the feather), only 1 of those 4 criteria need to be met to define as an adult. To which he replied, what if he comes in not in strut and I can't see his fan? He then proposed an adult gobbler be defined with a 3 inch beard instead. Then TWRA euphemistically called him an idiot.
 
shopson said:
Personally I don't care for the delayed opening. Those hunting the later part will be flushing hens off the nest.
I have no problem with 2 bird limit but saving the gobblers ain't the problem. Protect the hens and nesting areas. They will get bred even with minimal gobblers. More successful nests means more future gobblers.
Just my 2 cents
Click to expand...
That's the question... whether delayed season opening will allow more hens to successfully nest and hatch, thereby increasing poult production (without any data to support or refute). It makes sense (because the majority of breeding doesn't start until April 7 thru 10th on my farms)... but sometimes things that make sense don't actually make a difference in the real world.

Will bumping more hens off the nest by hunters the last 2 weeks of the season cause harm and ultimately make poult recruitment fall? Personally, I don't think so. First, because most hens that get flushed off the nest by a hunter will return once the threat is gone, and secondly, hens are much less likely to flush off the nest the later they are in the incubation process. Get to the last week of incubation, and you almost have to pick them up off the nest to get them to leave. They are going to freeze and stay put unless you step on them.
 
megalomaniac said:
Bill Cox literally said how can someone tell if a beard is 6 inches or not? When TWRA explained to him that beard length was only one requirement differentiating an adult from a juvenile (the other criteria being at least 1 spur 1/2 in or greater, a full fan, and primary wing feathers with barring extending to the end of the feather), only 1 of those 4 criteria need to be met to define as an adult. To which he replied, what if he comes in not in strut and I can't see his fan? He then proposed an adult gobbler be defined with a 3 inch beard instead. Then TWRA euphemistically called him an idiot.
Click to expand...
I'm almost to the point If you can't tell the difference in a longbeard, Jake, or hen then you should have your license revoked. But there was a time when I didn't know much either, so I won't go that far.

You can tell by tail fan, primary wing feathers, wing covert feathers, beard length, spur length, appearance and coloration and size of head, and sound of gobble.
All that being said, sometimes jakes will have adult characteristics such as sounding big or acting big with a big white/red head.
 
woodsman04 said:
I'm almost to the point If you can't tell the difference in a longbeard, Jake, or hen then you should have your license revoked. But there was a time when I didn't know much either, so I won't go that far.

You can tell by tail fan, primary wing feathers, wing covert feathers, beard length, spur length, appearance and coloration and size of head, and sound of gobble.
All that being said, sometimes jakes will have adult characteristics such as sounding big or acting big with a big white/red head.
Click to expand...
Agreed... you should not be allowed in the spring woods by yourself if you cannot differentiate between a jake or an adult. Nor should you be blasting away at just a red head peeking over a rise or in tall grass. It's not the end of the world to have to pass a bird because you aren't 100% certain it isn't a legal adult.

That being said, there WILL be some overzealous hunters that kill jakes illegally. Imo, if it's an honest mistake, you should be able to contact TWRA law enforcement, explan what happened, be issued a warning, and still be allowed to keep your bird if you are honest and up front. Make that mistake 3 or 4 times over the course of a decade, and you should be ticketed and bird confiscated.

I know a couple EXCELLENT lifelong turkeys hunters here in MS who have shot a jake once in their career (where jakes are illegal). Both incidences occurred before mandatory statewide check in. Almost happened to me down here last year and this year as well (tom came in with 2 or 3 jakes and I had the bead on the bird I thought was the tom waiting for confirmation, only to realize I was on the wrong bird once they got into the opening to change targets and kill the longbeard.)
 
megalomaniac said:
Agreed... you should not be allowed in the spring woods by yourself if you cannot differentiate between a jake or an adult. Nor should you be blasting away at just a red head peeking over a rise or in tall grass. It's not the end of the world to have to pass a bird because you aren't 100% certain it isn't a legal adult.

That being said, there WILL be some overzealous hunters that kill jakes illegally. Imo, if it's an honest mistake, you should be able to contact TWRA law enforcement, explan what happened, be issued a warning, and still be allowed to keep your bird if you are honest and up front. Make that mistake 3 or 4 times over the course of a decade, and you should be ticketed and bird confiscated.

I know a couple EXCELLENT lifelong turkeys hunters here in MS who have shot a jake once in their career (where jakes are illegal). Both incidences occurred before mandatory statewide check in. Almost happened to me down here last year and this year as well (tom came in with 2 or 3 jakes and I had the bead on the bird I thought was the tom waiting for confirmation, only to realize I was on the wrong bird once they got into the opening to change targets and kill the longbeard.)
Click to expand...
I shot a Jake once by accident and I'm not ashamed either. I watched a strutting longbeard disappear behind a white oak tree and emerge a strutting Jake. I waited about pulling the trigger until he got past that tree. Until this day I swear that longbeard pushed that Jake out in front of me 🤣 Anyway it does happen.
 
drake799 said:
You've got a month and half to kill your limit. How
Much more do you want lol
Click to expand...

I usually have to wake up at 3am by mid May to hunt a bird in a jungle that's in the mood 25% of the time..

It was 90 degrees in Mid May around here shut the birds right off..

Having the season open until Memorial day weekend in Tennessee is just flipping stupid..

If I have the opportunity I am taking 2 birds opening weekend and then its over.. Hmmmm I hope this works and saves the birds..
 
Back in the mid 90s I attended a turkey hunting seminar at Cherokee High School and a biologist with TWRA was answering questions on stage. One question was how soon after stocking turkeys can you start hunting them. His answer was the same season because most hens have already been bred by the time season opens. Another question was about spooking hens off the nest. His answer was spook them once and 60% of the time they won't return. Spook them twice and 100% no return. While I can't say yeah or nay from my own experience it does come from some one more educated to the subject than myself.
 
shopson said:
Back in the mid 90s I attended a turkey hunting seminar at Cherokee High School and a biologist with TWRA was answering questions on stage. One question was how soon after stocking turkeys can you start hunting them. His answer was the same season because most hens have already been bred by the time season opens. Another question was about spooking hens off the nest. His answer was spook them once and 60% of the time they won't return. Spook them twice and 100% no return. While I can't say yeah or nay from my own experience it does come from some one more educated to the subject than myself.
Click to expand...
Urban legend. Turkeys will abandon nests, like all birds, if they get disturbed on occasion, but no where near 60% of the time. I bumped one last year 4 times in three weeks (because of where she was I couldn't avoid her) and she hatched. That would be an exception IMO, but so would abandoning a nest after one disturbance.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top