Smallmouths and line? I have gone to braid finally from mono and haven't used it enough for smallies to tell. I caught some Largemouths on a worm last fall at the Hick and couldn't tell much difference but thats stained water. In clear water would braid hurt? Are the fish smart enough to see line and know what it is? If they can see line and put 2 and 2 together wouldn't they be smart enough to know the jig the line is tied to isn't a crawdad?
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Help Support TNDeer:
Can they see it and does it matter?
- Thread starter tsc
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Yes, on smallmouths, it DOES matter.
Not all the time... you can catch them sometimes on well rope, depending upon how hungry/aggressive they are, and water clarity.
But I know that in typical clear water, prime smallmouth fishing conditions... lighter line gets you more bites. Granted, that MIGHT be due as much to better lure presentation, but whatever the reason... light line hooks more fish (operative word - "hooks," not "boats."
That is up to the skill of the angler.)
Not all the time... you can catch them sometimes on well rope, depending upon how hungry/aggressive they are, and water clarity.
But I know that in typical clear water, prime smallmouth fishing conditions... lighter line gets you more bites. Granted, that MIGHT be due as much to better lure presentation, but whatever the reason... light line hooks more fish (operative word - "hooks," not "boats."
That is up to the skill of the angler.)So, A really light braid,like 6lb ,that is marked the first 10 feet with a marker would be the cat's meow? I really like the no stretch and the way you can feel the jig even grinding across a rock,I could never do that with mono. When I first started using it I thought everything was a hit,it took some getting use to.
MidTennFisher
Well-Known Member
Absolutely it matters!! In muddy water like a farm pond, you can tie 30lb braid straight to the jig and get away with it. I've done it many times. Smallies tend to be in clearer waters and yes they'll see braid. They even see mono on a sunny day so when I'm fishing clear lakes like Tims Ford I use 10# mono and a 15# flouro leader. About 4' of leader.
Now y'all have me paranoid about the braid,if you think about the A-rig it's got all them wires and swivels and stuff but it's the hottest thing out there? I guess I
ll get some flouro and fix me a leader then forget about it. What's the deal with flouro? Does it stretch alot? Will it cancel out the feel and hooksets of the braid?
ll get some flouro and fix me a leader then forget about it. What's the deal with flouro? Does it stretch alot? Will it cancel out the feel and hooksets of the braid?
MidTennFisher
Well-Known Member
I think the difference is that with the A-rig, it's a fast moving presentation. Fish have a second to decide whether to strike or not. For example, if you're banging crankbaits off shallow cover, you would still get more bites using flouro, but you'll get hungry fish to strike even with straight braid tied on. That second it deflects off a rock or stump it triggers what we know as the "reaction bite". That same fish wouldn't study a shaky head or a slowly fished jig for 10 seconds and decide to pick it up if it saw the line. If I'm finesse fishing a shaky head and a worm, I'm always using flouro leader in clear water.
Below Center Hill Dam I've had fantastic afternoons jigging kastmaster spoons tied straight to 30lb braid. I use the heavy line because in that generation current even a decent size trout can take off. If you luck into a 24" Brown with light tackle and a small spool it could easily spool you. That water is very clear and I'd get hit after hit. Trout are known to be particularly finicky fish too and when I'm fishing light spinning tackle on calm water it's always 2# flouro. The difference is the spoon is flashy and fast moving so it's a quick trigger reaction.
I always have flourocarbon leaders tied on unless it's one of these situations: frog fishing the grass mats, any topwater, or fast moving lures like crankbaits in stained water. In the cooler months almost any lake around here will be clearer than in the warm months because of the lack of algae blooms. Get a good spool of it and you won't regret it.
Below Center Hill Dam I've had fantastic afternoons jigging kastmaster spoons tied straight to 30lb braid. I use the heavy line because in that generation current even a decent size trout can take off. If you luck into a 24" Brown with light tackle and a small spool it could easily spool you. That water is very clear and I'd get hit after hit. Trout are known to be particularly finicky fish too and when I'm fishing light spinning tackle on calm water it's always 2# flouro. The difference is the spoon is flashy and fast moving so it's a quick trigger reaction.
I always have flourocarbon leaders tied on unless it's one of these situations: frog fishing the grass mats, any topwater, or fast moving lures like crankbaits in stained water. In the cooler months almost any lake around here will be clearer than in the warm months because of the lack of algae blooms. Get a good spool of it and you won't regret it.
SilverFox
Well-Known Member
If you use a leader on braid, make sure you let off on the drag. If not you'll risk break off on the hookset.
ChasingMossy
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If you are going to use braid then you owe it to yourself to tie a fluorocarbon leader. You will catch more fish period. Top water would be the only exception. This is JMO. For top water I will use braid or mono. For crank baits I'll use mono most of the time. For anything dragging the bottom it's important to use flourocarbon IMO.
larry ipock
Well-Known Member
When the waters cold, their metabolism is slowed down, so I don't think they can see quite as well than when the waters warmer. But yes, they can see it I believe. It also depends on the mood of the fish. But I've seen days when I was using 6# fluro, and the guy in the boat with me was using 8# clear bl flr line, and caught more fish with the same lure. Just goes to show, that there are no hard and fast rules with fishing.
It matters more in your mind than to the fish. Which, sometimes and to some people is just as bad.
ChasingMossy
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smalljawbasser":197ah5gt said:
I couldn't disagree more. And I don't mean that in a rude way. Really I don't. When fish are agressively feeding then you right it doesn't really matter what bait or line you throw. You will catch fish. But when the fish are pressured or not actively feeding then it makes a big difference. I hate to ever even disagree publicly with someone because I don't like controversy or arguing so to speak. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and I respect that very much
ChasingMossy
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tsc":3633ue7g said:
With the A-rig; you will generally be fishing around schools of bait, therefore catching fish that are actively feeding. Also you are generally gonna be catching more quality fish. Bigger fish are more agressive. And when they see that school of bait(a-rig) then they eat it.
Have you ever tried a dropshot? I can't think of a better smallmouth bait to fish close to the bottom
ChasingMossy":3gffqe9j said:
Hey, when people disagree amiably, there is no issue.
Let me go into more detail on my opinion, and maybe it'll help somebody.
Ive spent lots of time chasing them on holston, dale hollow, Cumberland and even Lake Erie, as well as spotted bass at Lanier, etc. Unless you go out west somewhere, water doesn't get any clearer.
I've seen it time and time again in side by side situations. Fluorescent line, braided line, heavy line, none of it will make a difference in how many bites you get, as far as them seeing your line. What really matters is that you use the right size and type of line to present your bait the right way. I do use the lightest line I can get by with in most situations, but not because I'm worried about them seeing my line.
just like deer, fish don't see like humans. plus, the environment they live in is not like ours. Based off my personal experience in using braids, Blue, and heavy lines side by side over the years, plus all the available research, I stand by my opinion that 99 times out of 100, they aren't going to see your line, or even more importantly, care if they do see it.
http://www.bradwiegmann.com/fish-biolog ... ision.html
However, fishing is very mental. And if you're worried that they see your line more than making the right adjustments, then it does matter, and you should do whatever you need to not to worry about anything but making the right presentations.
SilverFox
Well-Known Member
I tried some fluorocarbon line and still use it from time to time but only the original that I bought a couple years ago. I have mixed feelings on it. I have a buddy that I fish with that only uses fluorescent clear blue line like you use for night fishing. He uses it year round for everything unless the situation calls for braided line. He also uses heavier line that needed for the application. He catches a ton of fish and I often give him crap about it just because. He will hang a lure up and snatch and pop on it to get it loose and never check his line. It'll be so beat and cut up it looks milky and he will not fix it. His lack of care has really made me rethink just how much they see. We fish Douglas, Cherokee, Norris, Boone and South Holston so we are talking about pretty clear water.
One thing I will say... I tightline for bass during the winter. I use 4 pound high visibility yellow line. Never had a problem with it. I like to watch my line and I can't see the other colors in 4 pound line. I noticed that I caught bass often when crappie fishing tightline so just kept it simple and started using the same line when I target smallmouth. It's never kept me from catching fish and you're looking for clear water the way I target them especially with 1/16 oz heads and hair.
One thing I will say... I tightline for bass during the winter. I use 4 pound high visibility yellow line. Never had a problem with it. I like to watch my line and I can't see the other colors in 4 pound line. I noticed that I caught bass often when crappie fishing tightline so just kept it simple and started using the same line when I target smallmouth. It's never kept me from catching fish and you're looking for clear water the way I target them especially with 1/16 oz heads and hair.
Well...I stopped and got a spool of Vanish 8lb to match up to my 10lb braid. I fixed leaders about 6' long with a 4 turn surgeons knot and I'll go with that. Thanks for everybody's input on this,I guess I'm in the category of the kinda that needs every confidence edge I can get!
ChasingMossy
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smalljawbasser":42q86gu9 said:
We can certainly agree on the mental aspect of fishing being very imoprtant. I fish 4-5 days a week from March til muzzleloader opens and confidence is key in being successful. If I'm out there fishing a bait or technique that I have doubts about, then I might as well be fishing in a bathtub bc I'm not gonna catch much. But if I'm fishing something that I'm confident in I can go hours without a bite without ever losing concentration. Just going through the motions out there is my biggest struggle sometimes. That usually results in me not making a very good presentation
Crosshairy
Well-Known Member
I didn't see the question answered (sorry if I missed it), but fluorocarbon has less stretch than mono, but more than braid - which is essentially zero.
I fish straight fluoro on spools sometimes, and the biggest downside (other than cost) is that it seems to pick up line memory a bit worse than mono. There are some line treatment sprays that cost 4 or 5 bucks that seem to help if you spray down the spool every week or so.
A big factor in choosing line that has nothing to do with visibility is line diameter and buoyancy. For example - for topwater, never use fluoro, because the line sinks and messes up the action. When fishing finesse baits with little/no weight, large diameter lines drag in the water more, and cause the presentation to be unnatural. This is *part* of the reason why light lines often catch more fish - the lure behaves more like it is moving independently of whatever it's attached to..."naturally". On top of that, low diameter lines cast further due to less resistance in the air.
If you are a big fan of high sensitivity and long casting, you might try giving a spool of Berkley Nanofil a try. It's expensive and very thin, to the point that you have to tie a double-uni knot to keep from having knots pull through, but it adds significant distance onto casting. Sometimes getting far away from the bank/boat reduces how shy fish can be. I've found it to be a fun addition to my favorite spinning rod.
I fish straight fluoro on spools sometimes, and the biggest downside (other than cost) is that it seems to pick up line memory a bit worse than mono. There are some line treatment sprays that cost 4 or 5 bucks that seem to help if you spray down the spool every week or so.
A big factor in choosing line that has nothing to do with visibility is line diameter and buoyancy. For example - for topwater, never use fluoro, because the line sinks and messes up the action. When fishing finesse baits with little/no weight, large diameter lines drag in the water more, and cause the presentation to be unnatural. This is *part* of the reason why light lines often catch more fish - the lure behaves more like it is moving independently of whatever it's attached to..."naturally". On top of that, low diameter lines cast further due to less resistance in the air.
If you are a big fan of high sensitivity and long casting, you might try giving a spool of Berkley Nanofil a try. It's expensive and very thin, to the point that you have to tie a double-uni knot to keep from having knots pull through, but it adds significant distance onto casting. Sometimes getting far away from the bank/boat reduces how shy fish can be. I've found it to be a fun addition to my favorite spinning rod.
