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Lease prices

MidTennFisher said:
And they're all going to keep skyrocketing as long as people keep paying it. Not to be argumentative, but I have to ask the question - is continuing to pay for private land hunting access good or bad for the future of accessible hunting? We've all seen public land access disappear in certain areas and not too long ago most of Yanahli was in danger of this.

As states do inevitably lose some amount of access to public hunting land for various reasons, now private land will be less accessible because it's either leased up or too expensive for many who would like to lease it.

Not even that long ago most of these leased up tracts could be accessed by a handshake, polite conversation, and maybe offering to put in a bit of sweat equity for permission. Now it's all about writing checks and those checks aren't getting smaller.

For the price some people pay to lease land to hunt I would rather spend that on buying an entire processed cow from a local farmer and just go fishing more. Just my opinion. I worry the next generation won't have much left to hunt. Either a dwindling amount of public land or lease prices out of reach for most.
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You're probably not wrong, but sadly little to nothing anyone can do. I said it a few years ago but deer hunting is turning into duck hunting very fast. The public land, the lease prices, and all of it. It's where it's headed. Can't necessarily blame the land owners. It's going to get worse way worse before it gets better. We have lost a pile of acres to development so fewer acres as well.
 
deerhunter10 said:
You're probably not wrong, but sadly little to nothing anyone can do. I said it a few years ago but deer hunting is turning into duck hunting very fast. The public land, the lease prices, and all of it. It's where it's headed. Can't necessarily blame the land owners. It's going to get worse way worse before it gets better. We have lost a pile of acres to development so fewer acres as well.
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Fishing is right behind it, if not ahead. Yesterday I went to Academy to use my 20% discount on some fishing supplies and was shocked at how expensive many of the lures, hooks and such have gotten. I hadn't needed anything in some time but dang, what a jump on some items.
 
TheLBLman said:
The older hunters with the money are currently "carrying the weight" of the younger (and much less avid) hunters. As we older ones die out, many of the replacing younger hunters are more into just "meat" hunting than "trophy" buck hunting. They can get what they want from hunting without ever needing to lease anything.

This will make more private lands available at more reasonable prices in the future, for those more avid hunters?

The dynamics are constantly shifting, and in some areas, lease prices will keep going up, while they go down in others. One real "wild card" in Tennessee in particular is the spread of CWD and just how TWRA reacts to it. Another "wild card" is the economy in general.
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Couldn't agree more. Lease prices will fall in the future. It won't be next year, but it will be in the next decade.
 
deerhunter10 said:
You're probably not wrong, but sadly little to nothing anyone can do. I said it a few years ago but deer hunting is turning into duck hunting very fast. The public land, the lease prices, and all of it. It's where it's headed. Can't necessarily blame the land owners. It's going to get worse way worse before it gets better. We have lost a pile of acres to development so fewer acres as well.
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The only positive for deer hunters is there is a lot more land that can be hunted for deer than hunted for ducks.
 
BSK said:
The only positive for deer hunters is there is a lot more land that can be hunted for deer than hunted for ducks.
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Agreed.. we own and lease on ground we own I don't have as much of a problem sharing my deer pictures rather we kill them or trail camera pictures. But I will not share any and I am very secretive about our leases so much almost paranoid. People will lease stuff out from under you in a heart beat. One reason I share picture with you privately, but never post publicly here or on social media.
 
BSK said:
The only positive for deer hunters is there is a lot more land that can be hunted for deer than hunted for ducks.
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Agree, but also believe there will be far fewer duck hunters a decade from now.

Let me re-phrase that a bit.
It's not that there may be that many fewer "licensed" duck hunters, but more that the average licensed duck hunter will be hunting less, and less, as they get older.

Many deer hunters, and in large part due to high lease prices, have shifted over to more duck hunting, quite a few entirely quitting deer hunting. Many of these will, in a few years, replace their current duck hunting (which will come to be seen as too much "work") with perhaps a single "vacation" hunt or two to some far away place, may never deer or duck hunt again in TN.

Everything has somewhat a cyclical nature.
A few decades ago, the most popular hunting in TN was squirrel.
I suspect many of today's duck hunters will tire and turn to other activities,
some of which won't even be hunting anything.

As much as I wish it weren't the case, "sport" hunting is a dying form of recreation.
It is mainly in the "sport" hunting that participants spend the big money on land & leases.
By contrast . . . . .
"Meat" hunters tend to be "minimalists" with their pocketbooks.
 
TheLBLman said:
The older hunters with the money are currently "carrying the weight" of the younger (and much less avid) hunters. As we older ones die out, many of the replacing younger hunters are more into just "meat" hunting than "trophy" buck hunting. They can get what they want from hunting without ever needing to lease anything.

This will make more private lands available at more reasonable prices in the future, for those more avid hunters?
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I wish I was as positive as you about this, and I hope you are right. But I see that the younger crowd is the majority of the social me-me-media crowd who can't even practice with their bow without making a YouTube video and 10 Instagram posts about it.

They seem to be as addicted to likes, follows, and thousands of strangers falling all over themselves to comment how awesome they are as a druggie is to meth.

This addiction is definitely contributing to the leasing. Leasing up a piece of property can, more times than not, lead to more successful hunting. More successful hunting means more social media content to share. Maybe things will end up ok. I surely hope so. But I do think the trajectory we're on is horrible for the future of hunting access. Whether that be public or private land.
 
I'd respect the guy who paid for the land and tax's. Before I leased anything I'd spend time scouting. If it seemed worth it then I'd lease.

It all depends on what I find scouting. I like to scout after season ends and before everything starts to green up. What they did is what they will do again as long as no one gives them a reason to change.

No Sunday wouldn't bother me if the scouting was good, with one exception, if I'm traveling to hunt. Hate sitting around a day when away from home. Really don't like weekend hunting, too many people doing all kinds of things.
 
The mennonites tend to kill the heck out of deer in Morgan county around deer lodge. I would try to make sure you're not getting into a situation where you are paying lease fees and all the brothers are wiping out the deer. I also think that's high for what it is but I know people are desperate to have a place to go.
 
He had told me that his brothers, himself and his dad has hunted it when his dad owned it. Therefore they didnt need a license. Now that he owns it he would be the only other person hunting but did tell me its very unlikely that he would even have the time or desire.
 
HuntnFishEastTN said:
Now that he owns it he would be the only other person hunting but did tell me its very unlikely that he would even have the time or desire.
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So you're paying double-plus the going rate (for the area), no Sunday hunting, and the owner "may" also be hunting this 130-acre tract?
 
Football Hunter said:
If you want it, get it, Doctors and Lawyers are pushing lease prices way up, no big deal to them, many hunt
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Where have you been FH? Seems I talked to you a lot back in the day. Don't you have property near the buffalo river?

As far as lease prices, one of my FIL's leases near Gainesboro went from around $3500 to $13,000 from last year to this year. Granted, it's about 1500-2000 acres….but that's a huge jump in price. He's not going to pay that.
 
Some of these unreasonably high prices are simply being "asked" as a form of "fishing" for the possibility of getting it. I was just offered a 500-acre-plus wooded tract, exclusive to me and whomever I might allow, Sunday hunting included, not far from Deer Lodge, for less than $4 an acre. Should he come down to less than $3, might consider, but really don't "need" it, and it's simply not that convenient to me personally.

Any tract is worth whatever someone is willing to pay.
Same with any house; location is everything.
But those who might have been most able & willing are dying faster than we're losing lease availability, at least on a statewide and national level.

IMO, it is also a fallacy about doctors & lawyers leasing all the land, running the prices up in TN. Those with deep pockets are simply more likely to buy an airplane and better hunting land in some other state. And they may be less likely to over-pay a high price for mediocre hunting. The exception is when it's extremely convenient to their homes. So I'd expect lease prices around Davidson County to stay high and at least keep up with inflation ongoing.
 
JCDEERMAN said:
As far as lease prices, one of my FIL's leases near Gainesboro went from around $3500 to $13,000 from last year to this year. Granted, it's about 1500-2000 acres….but that's a huge jump in price. He's not going to pay that.
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Assuming 1,750 acres . . . . .
$3,500 was $2 an acre.
$13,000 would be $7.43 an acre.

Now, you may have just somewhat "made the case" regarding what I've been alluding.

And similar is happening statewide in TN on a wide scale, especially where a 3rd party "middleman" has entered the picture, promising the land owner much more money, yet the leasing agent will pack the land with lots of strangers, unvetted. Ultimately, much of this type leased "private" property becomes under more hunting pressure than most public lands.

What age is your "FIL"?
You need not answer, as we'll just assume he's a lot older than you :)

My point is, I suspect he could easily pay $7.43 an acre for this lease,
but he's "in the know", and knows it's not worth it.
Besides, he has plenty of other places to hunt for a lot less or "free".

Just saying, the dynamics are constantly changing.
Ultimately, price reflects value, but prices can be way low or way high throughout time.

Someone besides your FIL may lease that for $7.43 an acre,
but fair chance they'll let it go after 1 year.
The next year, it may get leased to someone else for a lower price than $7.43.
Or might be $10.

Only time will tell.
I just know your FIL isn't going to be a poor steward of his money,
and neither am I.

It will be up to the next generation to squander the family's fortune :)
 
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Years ago I inquired about a prime piece of ground in Will Co. Over 10 k for less than 200 acres. He got it but not from me. This was deer only , did not include turkey hunting.
 
TheLBLman said:
Assuming 1,750 acres . . . . .
$3,500 was $2 an acre.
$13,000 would be $7.43 an acre.

Now, you may have just somewhat "made the case" regarding what I've been alluding.

What age is your "FIL"?
You need not answer, as we'll just assume he's a lot older than you :)

My point is, I suspect he could easily pay $7.43 an acre for this lease,
but he's "in the know", and knows it's not worth it.
Besides, he has plenty of other places to hunt for a lot less or "free".

Just saying, the dynamics are constantly changing.
Ultimately, price reflects value, but prices can be way low or way high throughout time.

Someone besides your FIL may lease that for $7.43 an acre,
but fair chance they'll let it go after 1 year.
The next year, it may get leased to someone else for a lower price than $7.43.
Or might be $10.

Only time will tell.
I just know your FIL isn't going to be a poor steward of his money,
and neither am I.

It will be up to the next generation to squander the family's fortune :)
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Spot on!
 
TNTreeman said:
Years ago I inquired about a prime piece of ground in Will Co. Over 10 k for less than 200 acres. He got it but not from me. This was deer only , did not include turkey hunting.
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IMO, from the ground up ("Nashville Basin"), Williamson & Davidson Counties are the only two counties in TN that one might expect could produce a 150-class buck with regularity. So put all the wealthy people living within those counties, then of course, lease prices SHOULD be expected to be much higher in Williamson & Davidson counties.

So are houses. Same house in rural Williamson County would run maybe twice cost of same house in rural Knox County (which is still a metropolitan area)?

The soil & antler growing conditions aren't going to change much in Williamson County a decade from now. But the economy COULD become horrible, totally changing all the dynamics, except which soils are more conducive to growing bucks with larger antlers.

TN's statewide soils can never even come close to many other states' statewide soils, when it comes to antler-growing potential. Williamson County, TN is a rare exception (for TN), but then it doesn't even come close to the potential of Ballard County, KY.
 
TheLBLman said:
So you're paying double-plus the going rate (for the area), no Sunday hunting, and the owner "may" also be hunting this 130-acre tract?
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Yes the land owner will be allowed to hunt if he wants. Thats how my Dad has always done it on his leases, an incentive to the owner if you will. Ive always hunted with my Dad on his leases for free this is my first one, he did go in half with me, but now I can throw around some ideas with planting a small plot and stand placement.
 

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