My opinion on broad heads this year!

[double browtine]

Going to go buy some new heads tomorrow. I am torn between the nap killzones and the schwackers. I have used nap products in the past with success, thunderheads and spitfires. Every nap product hit just like my field points in the past. Has anyone shot both and have an opinion? Great thread by the way!

 

[UTGrad]

Look,
I am not a scientist, so giving you EXACT, scientific details on knife sharpening just isn't going to happen.

What I can do is take HUGE amounts of information, say from a data pool of FIVE HUNDRED BOW KILLED deer, and translate THAT information into something PRACTICAL.

And here is what I have learned.

Dull broadheads simply PUSH veins and arteries out of the way, rather than slicing through them thus causing more severe bleeding and a quicker death.

Afterall, archery killed deer die from BLOOD LOSS. (unless it is asphyxiation due to lung collapse and diaphram damage)

I have recovered over 200 arrow killed deer personally and been involved with HUNDREDS more, gun and bow. I am pretty sure I have seen about every wound channel imaginable, and some that should NEVER be imagined.

DULL blades kill deer. And VERY effectively when you are talking about BOTH lungs. But, according to MY experience, NOT AS EFFECTIVELY as VERY SHARP HEADS.

And finally, I will add this. So many times I have heard hunters say, "hey, I hit that deer way too far back and he dropped after running ONLY a few yards". Yet they had NO CLUE that even thought they did indeed hit the animal high and back, toward the guts, the arrow sliced through the KIDNEYS, A LETHAL but VERY low percentage shot. Or maybe "hey, I GUT shot that deer RIGHT THROUGH THE STOMACH, and it fell after only 75 yards". And yet the hunter had NO IDEA that they sliced the pyloric artery in half.

Luck always plays a role in killing. But luck plays little role in killing effectively, humanely, purposefully, and CONSISTENTLY!!!

SHARP, WIDE (as you can afford), ACCURATE.

102,

Is there a REASON you have to capitalize your main points in a post? It comes across to me like I'm getting LECTURED. I appreciate your knowledge but you are not the ONLY person with solid advice or opinion.

 

[102]

I can and will "lecture" if someone wants to be lectured.
But capitalizing was not intended to "LECTURE" in my writing.

I capitalize to EMPHASIZE a point I am trying to make.

And that point is to try to shed some light on yet another way for the TV media "propaganda bandits" to separate so many hard working hunters from their hard earned dollars.

It is absolutely NOT necessary to spend FIFTEEN dollars per broadhead to kill a deer effectively. There are PLENTY of SHARP, ACCURATE, and WIDE heads that one can buy that will do nicely.

If this comes across as a lecture, or "a gorilla beating his chest" or a "know it all" or whatever may offend, just place me on your ignore list and all will be fine.

But before you do this, I ask you to help me understand how can I can help other fellow bowhunters NOT make some of the same irritating, wasteful, costly and SICKENING mistakes I have made over the past 30 years by sharing my knowledge WITHOUT sounding like a know it all?

Or someone "beating my own chest". Or someone trying to brag or whatever.

It's funny, but in the past, when I have spoken in groups, I don't get this same reaction as I do occasionally on a message board. I wonder if it is just easier to voice agitation with a writer.

And one more thing. If I were asking questions about a topic like broadheads or ANYTHING to do with any subject for that matter, I would want answers from people who had the MOST experience available. NOT from people who just had ideas or a little experience. If that sounds like ego issues, ignore me.

 

[richmanbarbeque]

At times it appears 102 comes across as cocky, arrogant and whatever you want to think. in the past I have felt the same way. I now look at him as trying to get across his experiences so other people learn not to make mistakes he may have made in the past. I am sure he will admit he doesn't know everything but him and his hunting buddies have a lot of experience. Now, when he starts chasing gut shot deer like Bowriter and name dropping we can all kick him in the nuts but until then I will try to learn what I can.

 

[Crow Terminator]

102 -- You're alright by me. No complaints here. Experience is the best teacher....listening to experience is right there with it. Sometimes newer archers act just like teenagers...they know it all and ain't nobody gonna tell them different. Then they get some time under their belt and they see them ole folks weren't as dumb and outdated as they first thought.

Now onto broadheads. I like mine sharp as well but I look at blade thickness and material as well. I like the concept of mechanical heads but I find most have really thin blades with very fine sharpened edges...basically my findings have been that these edges will dull extremely fast and why so many are bent or broken upon retrieving...just aren't built well. VS some of the thick blade fixed heads....where you can blow through a deer and still be sharp enough to cut you really bad.

Two of the sharpest out of pack broadheads I've handled have been the Slick Tricks and a G5 Stryker. In mechanicals it would be the Grim Reapers. I have a Slick Trick my wife killed a deer with that still has hair and gore on it...the blades aren't nicked or rolled over and its still sharper than some heads I've pulled straight out of the packages.

 

[scn]

At times it appears 102 comes across as cocky, arrogant and whatever you want to think. in the past I have felt the same way. I now look at him as trying to get across his experiences so other people learn not to make mistakes he may have made in the past. I am sure he will admit he doesn't know everything but him and his hunting buddies have a lot of experience. Now, when he starts chasing gut shot deer like Bowriter and name dropping we can all kick him in the nuts but until then I will try to learn what I can.

x2 on 102, Rich.

I think this is my 43 consecutive bow season. I've seen a lot of changes and waded through a lot of bs during those years. You learn to recognize knowledge. When 102 and Radar speak about bows and bow hunting, I listen and learn.

 

[thejetman]

What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year. My belief is that the arrows are going so fast now that any discrepency between broadhead and wind will throw it off. They act like "canards" on an aircraft. I switched to mechanicals because, in my experiance, were more accurate than my ol Muzzies. I have killed many deer with a fixed blade head. But speed exemplifies inconsistencies in arrow/broadhead/fletching configurations. Its all just a theory though.

 

[TNDeerGuy]

What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year. My belief is that the arrows are going so fast now that any discrepency between broadhead and wind will throw it off. They act like "canards" on an aircraft. I switched to mechanicals because, in my experiance, were more accurate than my ol Muzzies. I have killed many deer with a fixed blade head. But speed exemplifies inconsistencies in arrow/broadhead/fletching configurations. Its all just a theory though.

It actually is not a theory, you have brought up a very valid point, one that many don't consider�the effects on air movement around a broadhead and the proper fletching. Even though many of us agree that the key to proper arrow flight is a properly tuned arrow and bow, the correlation between broadhead flight and the type of fletching is often removed from the equation because of the popularity of the mini fletchings such as the Blazer. In certain cases, some of the larger profile designed broadheads will require the stability and control a larger fletching, such as a 4-inch vane, will give so that it negates, or minimizes, the effects of the "canard" effect coming from the front of the arrow.

Muzzy's are stone-cold killers and have definately stood up to the test of time, but I have seen in several cases that they can be finicky. All that is needed is the time and patience to figure out the "sweet-spot" of someone's entire setup. Most just don't take the time, or have the tools, to find that "sweet-spot"�it's not intended as a knock, just a fact.

 

[TheLBLman]

What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year.

Muzzy's are stone-cold killers and have definately stood up to the test of time, but I have seen in several cases that they can be finicky. All that is needed is the time and patience to figure out the "sweet-spot" of someone's entire setup. Most just don't take the time, or have the tools, to find that "sweet-spot"�it's not intended as a knock, just a fact.

x 2

Muzzys had been my head of choice for many, many years.
But believe there are better-flying heads today, reasonably priced.

This year, I'm hunting with 4-blade Slick-Tricks which I believe are a tad more forgiving and with more total cutting edge than the 3-blade muzzys.

 

[thejetman]

What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year. My belief is that the arrows are going so fast now that any discrepency between broadhead and wind will throw it off. They act like "canards" on an aircraft. I switched to mechanicals because, in my experiance, were more accurate than my ol Muzzies. I have killed many deer with a fixed blade head. But speed exemplifies inconsistencies in arrow/broadhead/fletching configurations. Its all just a theory though.

Right. I had to refletch my arrows to make the Muzzies shot right. I had to remove the blazer vanes. And I installed Bigger fusion vanes with a helical fletch. Then I had to spend a week dialing it in. Then, I bought some Rage heads, and had to start all over. The muzzies shot high out of the same setup, 4 inches to be exact. With older, slower bows, the effect of wind accross the blades was negligable at best. But, the faster an object moves through air, the more suseptable it is to drag, at any point, and will then make small differences in resistance huge differences in flight.

 

[thejetman]

What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year.

Muzzy's are stone-cold killers and have definately stood up to the test of time, but I have seen in several cases that they can be finicky. All that is needed is the time and patience to figure out the "sweet-spot" of someone's entire setup. Most just don't take the time, or have the tools, to find that "sweet-spot"�it's not intended as a knock, just a fact.

x 2

Muzzys had been my head of choice for many, many years.
But believe there are better-flying heads today, reasonably priced.

This year, I'm hunting with 4-blade Slick-Tricks which I believe are a tad more forgiving and with more total cutting edge than the 3-blade muzzys.

I also found that the pack of Muzzy heads I bought this year to be all over the board in variations to weight. I have a set of muzzy blades from 10 years ago that are sharper and tighter in respect to weight then the pack I bought this year. My old ones flew just fine. But, for some reason, the ones I got this year would not group at all. Period. They were all over the place. Different manufacturing techniques? I don't know. Also I want to add, Its really hard to fletch a Nano diameter arrow with a helical fletch. There is almost no surface area left on the back of the arrow when its all said and done.

 

[Radar]

102 -- You're alright by me. No complaints here. Experience is the best teacher....listening to experience is right there with it. Sometimes newer archers act just like teenagers...they know it all and ain't nobody gonna tell them different. Then they get some time under their belt and they see them ole folks weren't as dumb and outdated as they first thought.

Now onto broadheads. I like mine sharp as well but I look at blade thickness and material as well. I like the concept of mechanical heads but I find most have really thin blades with very fine sharpened edges...basically my findings have been that these edges will dull extremely fast and why so many are bent or broken upon retrieving...just aren't built well. VS some of the thick blade fixed heads....where you can blow through a deer and still be sharp enough to cut you really bad.

Two of the sharpest out of pack broadheads I've handled have been the Slick Tricks and a G5 Stryker. In mechanicals it would be the Grim Reapers. I have a Slick Trick my wife killed a deer with that still has hair and gore on it...the blades aren't nicked or rolled over and its still sharper than some heads I've pulled straight out of the packages.

I have had the same experience with Slick Tricks and G5 Strykers . Both have thick , strong blades that hold a good edge , and a low profile that flies well at higher speeds .
I also shoot mechanicals , such as the Rage , and I'll be trying the new Ulmer Edge this year .
I have learned through experience that the best broadhead is the one I have confidence in , that flies the best out of my setup , and is a durable head . I sharpen any dull blades before using .
One thing that bothers me about these forums are some of of newer Bowhunters who we have all helped get started out right on this forum , disrespecting the older guys like 102 who have more experience . I always looked up to my mentors who helped me out , long before the Internet .
I guess it's easier to disrespect someone behind a computer monitor .

 

[Big J]

What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year.

Muzzy's are stone-cold killers and have definately stood up to the test of time, but I have seen in several cases that they can be finicky. All that is needed is the time and patience to figure out the "sweet-spot" of someone's entire setup. Most just don't take the time, or have the tools, to find that "sweet-spot"�it's not intended as a knock, just a fact.

x 2
Dude! You shooting a nano hunting?

Muzzys had been my head of choice for many, many years.
But believe there are better-flying heads today, reasonably priced.

This year, I'm hunting with 4-blade Slick-Tricks which I believe are a tad more forgiving and with more total cutting edge than the 3-blade muzzys.

I also found that the pack of Muzzy heads I bought this year to be all over the board in variations to weight. I have a set of muzzy blades from 10 years ago that are sharper and tighter in respect to weight then the pack I bought this year. My old ones flew just fine. But, for some reason, the ones I got this year would not group at all. Period. They were all over the place. Different manufacturing techniques? I don't know. Also I want to add, Its really hard to fletch a Nano diameter arrow with a helical fletch. There is almost no surface area left on the back of the arrow when its all said and done.

 

[Big J]

102 -- You're alright by me. No complaints here. Experience is the best teacher....listening to experience is right there with it. Sometimes newer archers act just like teenagers...they know it all and ain't nobody gonna tell them different. Then they get some time under their belt and they see them ole folks weren't as dumb and outdated as they first thought.

Now onto broadheads. I like mine sharp as well but I look at blade thickness and material as well. I like the concept of mechanical heads but I find most have really thin blades with very fine sharpened edges...basically my findings have been that these edges will dull extremely fast and why so many are bent or broken upon retrieving...just aren't built well. VS some of the thick blade fixed heads....where you can blow through a deer and still be sharp enough to cut you really bad.

Two of the sharpest out of pack broadheads I've handled have been the Slick Tricks and a G5 Stryker. In mechanicals it would be the Grim Reapers. I have a Slick Trick my wife killed a deer with that still has hair and gore on it...the blades aren't nicked or rolled over and its still sharper than some heads I've pulled straight out of the packages.

I have had the same experience with Slick Tricks and G5 Strykers . Both have thick , strong blades that hold a good edge , and a low profile that flies well at higher speeds .
I also shoot mechanicals , such as the Rage , and I'll be trying the new Ulmer Edge this year .
I have learned through experience that the best broadhead is the one I have confidence in , that flies the best out of my setup , and is a durable head . I sharpen any dull blades before using .
One thing that bothers me about these forums are some of of newer Bowhunters who we have all helped get started out right on this forum , disrespecting the older guys like 102 who have more experience . I always looked up to my mentors who helped me out , long before the Internet .
I guess it's easier to disrespect someone behind a computer monitor .

Good post brother!

 

[Big J]

I have a lot of respect for all hunters. Including the newbie that is looking for the correct way to do things in the woods. I have a lot of respect for Radar, BBQ,SCN and even that lunatic bowriter. J/K buddy. I have been hunting for a while and I still don't think I know jack squat. So cool the testosterone and listen before speaking! Just my 2 cents.

 

[UTGrad]

Well I'm getting a good whoopin online here but I still think 102 acts "holier than thou". Sure he is knowledgeable but he lurks on the forum to jump out and give a thesis statement. I appreciate the advice but 102's delivery comes across like he is the word from the burning bush.

Radar, you've been blasting me for a while now, nothing new. I will say archery has been my passion for a few years now and I'm not a rookie anymore. It gets old being treated like a rookie.

 

[Radar]

Well I'm getting a good whoopin online here but I still think 102 acts "holier than thou". Sure he is knowledgeable but he lurks on the forum to jump out and give a thesis statement. I appreciate the advice but 102's delivery comes across like he is the word from the burning bush.

Radar, you've been blasting me for a while now, nothing new. I will say archery has been my passion for a few years now and I'm not a rookie anymore. It gets old being treated like a rookie.

Whatever , it's posts like this that turn me off to posting on forums anymore . I'm glad there are a few experienced voices out there to mentor those getting thier start in bow hunting . Some appreciate it , some dont . There is a big difference between killing foam than there is killing deer !

 

[fourwheeler431]

I will say archery has been my passion for a few years now and I'm not a rookie anymore. It gets old being treated like a rookie.

How many years is "a few years"? 2,3 at the most. most of these guys have 25+ years of experience,hell I'm still a rookie compared to most of them and I have 20 years myself.

 

[UTGrad]

Radar I appeciate all your help but I still remember your thread from last year when you didn't call me by name but Secret Squirrel told you I did a mid year bow swap. You blasted me pretty good. Well, that MR6 is a mighty fine bow and will be in the woods for another season. It draws smooth and it is a shooter. I wouldn't be surprised if you knew how I got the funds to buy that bow. Well let me say I shoot the MR6 almost everyday and don't regret it one bit. I got my "value" out of the deal.

 

[ImThere]

I have been shooting a bow for nearly all my life. I have been hunting deer for a few years and i still dont know nothing and i apperciate all the input. shooting a bow and shooting deer are two completly different things