Selling of duck blinds...

[Smashdn]

Anything that reduces licenses and duck stamps sold is a bad idea. Your PR funds are tied to those numbers. Lot of implications.

Forcing the drawn hunter to be there isn't really a good option either. Being a sign on is kind of the reward for helping fix the blind.

Until you address guiding from public blinds, which I don't see them doing, the buying selling will continue as some folks have built a livelihood based on guiding hunters.

Some western states require oos hunters to use guides on big game hunts. There are plenty of guys guiding on blm and other public areas. There are elk guides in ky that put people on public ground. Same as fishing guides on reelfoot or ky lake.

 

[flyinpro]

The only way they'll ever stop the selling is to make it where only card holders can hunt it Someone in the blind has to have a card. But technically even that couldn't stop it from being sold But it could possibly help with some of the over hunting/pressure people keep mentioning

I think that is a good idea. If it's a 3-4 hunt on a drawn blind, only the person who drew the blind should be allowed to hunt it during that period. No blind hopping allowed.

I am also against the selling of the drawn blinds. The TWRA could easily fix that problem.

 

[Dodge Man]

Speaking of being Rigged,here is a little known fact. A new TWRA officer's father was #1 pick this year. Go figure. Lucky?

I trust you if you say efforts were made to come up with an enforcement solution. But I don't follow the logic of not using a "sting" type approach for fear of future unsuccessful people claiming that the system is rigged. I've heard people complain about the system being rigged all my life anyway. (To be clear, I have never once agreed with that conspiracy theory).

I think if the game wardens that are present to help fill out cards would stand in the crowd during the draw especially closer to the stage would stop a lot of buying. I have seen multiple times "known" people that buy blinds stop a single person or small groups and make an offer. Usually they would stand near the steps going to the stage to be able to make an offer before the person gets all of his sign on.

 

[Southern Sportsman]

And it seems to me all they have to do is make duck blind draws non transferrable. People can still blind hop, but "ownership" belongs to who drew it and those that signed on. To me it would be hard to sell if you can't claim the blind as your own.

Actually how does that currently happen anyway? When a blind is sold, does the buyer become the "owner" as if he drew the blind?

Seems like that would be easy to enforce.

They are absolutely non-transferrable under the current (apparently outgoing) system. "Ownership" does/did belong to the person who drew and whoever signs on. And it is illegal to buy, sell, barter for, etc. But it happens/happened in plain sight every year.

The way it typically happened was someone drew early and started slowly walking to the stage. People looking to buy approached them on their way to the front and made offers. If agreed, the buyer would walk up with them and sign on for the blind. Then the seller would give the buyer their card so only the buyer had a card for the blind.

To combat that, a couple years ago the rules required sign-ons to declare before the draw. But people still bought blinds — they just didn't have a card for it. But the "buyer" just built/brushed/decoyed the blind and hunted it like they owned it. Unless someone else knew they didn't have a card and was willing to push the issue by showing up first to "hop" the blind, and refusing to leave unless a card-holder was present, the buyer had free reign of it.

 

[Smashdn]

Season before last they put the drawn hunters back in the tumbler and drew for picking order. Just because you got drawn first initially didn't mean you had first pick.

The crowd cleared out after the first draw significantly. IIRC you had to declare your sign ons after the first draw and those sign ons couldnt then get drawn themselves. Seemed to work.

 

[Headhunter]

No one has made even a remote point as to why the selling of blinds should be illegal. Not even close. Is it the fact you don't have enough money? I don't, not even close, well I guess I could spare a few dollars, literally a few dollars.

So long the draw is fair, not rigged in any way, why should anyone care if a blind is sold, rented, etc.? I just don't understand.

If the person who drew the blind and people who sign on hunt it every day and a blind owner is there before legal shooting time, you couldn't hunt it anyways. If it is sold, who cares and why? Other than the TWRA says so, why is it illegal?

Only thing that ever bothered me was the people who could afford to buy attempts at being drawn, buying license for many people for the specific purpose of getting drawn so they can sign on.

 

[Headhunter]

I think that is a good idea. If it's a 3-4 hunt on a drawn blind, only the person who drew the blind should be allowed to hunt it during that period. No blind hopping allowed.

I am also against the selling of the drawn blinds. The TWRA could easily fix that problem.

Why no blind hopping? I believe you said blinds shouldn't be sold because the public owns the land, then why no blind hopping? To me if is empty, anyone should be able to hunt the blind.

 

[MickThompson]

No one has made even a remote point as to why the selling of blinds should be illegal. Not even close. Is it the fact you don't have enough money? I don't, not even close, well I guess I could spare a few dollars, literally a few dollars.

So long the draw is fair, not rigged in any way, why should anyone care if a blind is sold, rented, etc.? I just don't understand.

If the person who drew the blind and people who sign on hunt it every day and a blind owner is there before legal shooting time, you couldn't hunt it anyways. If it is sold, who cares and why? Other than the TWRA says so, why is it illegal?

Only thing that ever bothered me was the people who could afford to buy attempts at being drawn, buying license for many people for the specific purpose of getting drawn so they can sign on.

If it was as simple as just a staked blind location, I might agree. But we are talking about millions of dollars of land, equipment, and infrastructure that's paid for by the hunters of TN. Heck, a corn crop runs over $500/acre to grow, never mind the cost to flood it.

It would be a violation of the Public Trust doctrine, a cornerstone of the North American model of wildlife management, for TWRA to intentionally manage lands for the rich few instead of managing that resource to be available to be available to everyone.

 

[flyinpro]

Why no blind hopping? I believe you said blinds shouldn't be sold because the public owns the land, then why no blind hopping? To me if is empty, anyone should be able to hunt the blind.

My thought on it is akin to places like Thorny WMA. If the person who drew it is not there, it goes un-hunted. If the guy who drew the blind gets delayed for any reason (ie not familiar, wasn't able to recon ahead of time etc....) so he doesn't have locals to argue with about when shooting light was.

No I don't think selling blinds should be legal.

 

[younggun308]

A lot changed in 11 years on this site, apparently.
What was self-evidently deemed unfair in 2010 is today hailed as the mark of a "free country." I suppose we could extend the principle to allowing the selling of votes during elections. So long as the right to vote is fairly given to every citizen in good standing with the law, why should anyone care what I do with my vote?

 

[Headhunter]

If it was as simple as just a staked blind location, I might agree. But we are talking about millions of dollars of land, equipment, and infrastructure that's paid for by the hunters of TN. Heck, a corn crop runs over $500/acre to grow, never mind the cost to flood it.

It would be a violation of the Public Trust doctrine, a cornerstone of the North American model of wildlife management, for TWRA to intentionally manage lands for the rich few instead of managing that resource to be available to be available to everyone.

Still doesn't say why it should be illegal? How is it managing for the rich few? Everyone gets to draw for a blind, equally. Whoever draws the blind should be able to hunt it, rent it, sell it, etc. Tell me why not?

 

[Headhunter]

My thought on it is akin to places like Thorny WMA. If the person who drew it is not there, it goes un-hunted. If the guy who drew the blind gets delayed for any reason (ie not familiar, wasn't able to recon ahead of time etc....) so he doesn't have locals to argue with about when shooting light was.

No I don't think selling blinds should be legal.

Why should it go unhunted? It is a blind on public land, if no one is there then anyone should be able to hunt it.

Still didn't say why, just what you think. Are to many ducks killed if a blind is sold? Does the land the blind is use suffer damage from it being sold?

You sound like a liberal politician who says I don't think it should be legal for anyone to own a gun. No valid reason, I just think anyone should be able to.

 

[younggun308]

Still doesn't say why it should be illegal? How is it managing for the rich few? Everyone gets to draw for a blind, equally. Whoever draws the blind should be able to hunt it, rent it, sell it, etc. Tell me why not?

You've gotten several long-form responses explaining quite plainly why it violates the principles of public land management, and general fairness. Insisting you've gotten no such response when you've gotten plenty is no more truthful than me shouting with conviction "it's daylight" at 02:00am.

 

[Headhunter]

A lot changed in 11 years on this site, apparently.
What was self-evidently deemed unfair in 2010 is today hailed as the mark of a "free country." I suppose we could extend the principle to allowing the selling of votes during elections. So long as the right to vote is fairly given to every citizen in good standing with the law, why should anyone care what I do with my vote?

How is that even comparable? You don't go to a blind draw to get to vote. You have a right to vote. You only get the blind if you are drawn.

 

[Headhunter]

You've gotten several long-form responses explaining quite plainly why it violates the principles of public land management, and general fairness. Insisting you've gotten no such response when you've gotten plenty is no more truthful than me shouting with conviction "it's daylight" at 02:00am.

I have not seen one response that does anything other than say it should not be legal. What part of selling a blind has anything to do with land management? General fairness, that is the liberal mindset the new blind proposals were created from.

One person did say it privileges rich people, but how? Unless the drawing is rigged, everyone has the same chance. Once you draw the blind it is yours to do with what you want or don't want. Wonder if you draw it, just sit in it the whole season, but never kill a duck, just sit and watch. That would be their option.

Unless the drawing is rigged, what is wrong with renting or selling a drawn blind? Give a valid reason other than being jealous, or it is unfair because someone else has more money. If there was only one option, meaning you had to compete with people who have more money for a blind, that is different. If everyone goes through the same draw process and it is a clean, fair drawing, who cares what anyone does with that blind as far as selling or renting goes?

 

[scn]

It is pretty simple, Sam. The Commission made the decision years ago that the opportunity to hunt these WMA Duck blinds belonged to the public at large and that the selling of blinds favored a rich few. They passed a Rule and Regulation that was reviewed by the state legislature that made such selling illegal.

You obviously disagree with the rule, and, that is certainly your right. If it bothers you as much as it apparently does, I would highly suggest you be at the Commission meeting next week in Franklin to voice your views to the Commission and ask them to change that regulation.

Right or wrong, that is the way the system works.

 

[hard county]

I have not seen one response that does anything other than say it should not be legal. What part of selling a blind has anything to do with land management? General fairness, that is the liberal mindset the new blind proposals were created from.

One person did say it privileges rich people, but how? Unless the drawing is rigged, everyone has the same chance. Once you draw the blind it is yours to do with what you want or don't want. Wonder if you draw it, just sit in it the whole season, but never kill a duck, just sit and watch. That would be their option.

Unless the drawing is rigged, what is wrong with renting or selling a drawn blind? Give a valid reason other than being jealous, or it is unfair because someone else has more money. If there was only one option, meaning you had to compete with people who have more money for a blind, that is different. If everyone goes through the same draw process and it is a clean, fair drawing, who cares what anyone does with that blind as far as selling or renting goes?

I'm just curious, is it ok in your opinion to sell food stamps?

 

[Dodge Man]

I'm just curious, is it ok in your opinion to sell food stamps?

If you want an opinion!
My opinion would be if you can afford to sell your food stamps then you have no real need for food stamps! I don't know what that has to do with this topic.

 

[THE DUKE]

I see no problem with the selling or renting of blinds. If you are there at the drawing and get drawed then so be it, should be able to do what you want. The years my group has been drawn for a blind we have to spend a lot of money reseeding, weed control, renting equipment, doing stuff that was supposed to be already done. Had a bad experience last year with a certain gw that was the area manager for this lake, but because someone that knew someone at twra and they we're on the board and a commissioner he got told what to do right or wrong which in this case was oblivious wrong.

 

[GUNNERX2]

I think some are losing sight that with the buying & selling of blinds, non-hunters were entering the draw with the hope of being drawn and selling that bind for a cash cow. The computer draw will cut into that but I feel confident that some have a work around for that behavior. In my part of the state, buying/selling has not been an issue although a neighbor told me that he did sell his #1 pick for $1000 years ago.