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Where do the bucks go every year?

BSK said:
Unfortunately - and I will take some of the blame for this - QDM concepts got a bit oversold. Too many hunters think passing up middle-aged bucks is going to assure those bucks will be back as mature bucks in later years. Yes, this does work quite well on large properties, say those over 1,000 acres. And especially those in the 2,500+ acre range. However, on the small 10 to 50-acre parcels, not so much. Heck, I've got 500 acres, and we do see some bucks back from year to year, but it is a minority. I've never tried to calculate the percentage, but someday I'll get around to it. But I would guess that maybe 20% of passed 2 1/2s make it maturity on our property, and maybe 33% of 3 1/2 year-olds. Abd we certainly do see the occasional mature buck show up that we've never seen before.

This is just me personally, but instead of being frustrated year after year hoping to produce some mature bucks on a small property, I would learn through trail-cams what the best you can consistently hope to produce, and then target those bucks. Maybe that's just an above average 3 1/2. But I would set my goals using the reality of the situation.
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I have no data behind it as I haven't kept all pictures. But from 2.5 to 4.5 and being able to keep up with them all 3 years is a tiny percentage for us. Of course not all bucks are identifiable at 2.5. It's qdm and t.v. shows, show a fantasy for the vast majority of people. Our biggest place is 500 acres and borders on 1/2 of it something illegal to hunt and still struggle to keep a lot of the deer we pass. I would also think maybe it's nature's way of keeping inbreeding at a minimum? We have come to flow with it as we always have mature deer to hunt but a lot of those we don't have history with. I will say if you get a deer to 4.5 they seem to stay in our experience to 5.5 and we have killed 3 deer 6.5 and one 7.5.
 
slabhead said:
I guess what I'm trying to say is...for the last 3 years we've had 6s and 8s on camera pretty much all year, even at the end of deer season...the next year we'll have 6s and 8s, might have one that is a bigger 8, maybe from the previous year, sometimes you can tell and sometimes you can't. I guess I was just expecting if we let the 6s and 8s walk, eventually they'd grow, but it seems they leave and new batch of 6s 8s take their place the next year.

i'm guessing based on some great comments here that when they get a little age on them they may be moving to a track that better suites them. This track just may not have what a mature buck is wanting/needing. I've got to figure out a way to keep a few coming back each year if I can.
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Sometimes those deer you are passing are probably simply getting killed on neighboring properties (and by neighboring I mean within 2 miles in all directions). They roam a lot more than people realize. One of the most interesting findings of the GPS studies is that a buck is more likely to make excursions as it gets OLDER. This is completely in contrary to what many preached for years. (The idea that a big mature buck eventually stops moving and becomes nocturnal and never leaves 40 acres of safety).

Other's may have shifted their range temporarily or permanently due to factors outside of your control. If you think about it, after 2.5 is when deer start to get the most territorial. It's very possible that 2.5 year old that kinda blended in before has now been pressured by other deer to relocate.

Even best case scenario (thousands of acres and low hunting pressure) you will see hunting channels where they have watched a buck on closely managed properties for a few years, and then it just goes missing for a year. They assume it died and then the next year it shows back up. These creatures are just unpredictable.
 
I learned something this year relates to this. Cell cams acting up so put two on same spot. New camera picking up deer moving behind old one. Ithink they didn't like the camera and moved just far enough to feel comfy in a main travel corridor.
 
I think deer move based on what they smell. Like preferred food, estrogen, danger, comfort. Especially since they can smell better than a dog. Just my opinion.
 
BSK said:
Unfortunately - and I will take some of the blame for this - QDM concepts got a bit oversold. Too many hunters think passing up middle-aged bucks is going to assure those bucks will be back as mature bucks in later years. Yes, this does work quite well on large properties, say those over 1,000 acres. And especially those in the 2,500+ acre range. However, on the small 10 to 50-acre parcels, not so much. Heck, I've got 500 acres, and we do see some bucks back from year to year, but it is a minority. I've never tried to calculate the percentage, but someday I'll get around to it. But I would guess that maybe 20% of passed 2 1/2s make it maturity on our property, and maybe 33% of 3 1/2 year-olds. Abd we certainly do see the occasional mature buck show up that we've never seen before.

This is just me personally, but instead of being frustrated year after year hoping to produce some mature bucks on a small property, I would learn through trail-cams what the best you can consistently hope to produce, and then target those bucks. Maybe that's just an above average 3 1/2. But I would set my goals using the reality of the situation.
Click to expand...
Great post and from my experience, this is 100% accurate. I had eight 9 pters last year that were 2 1/2 and 3 1/2 years old. Out of those 8 bucks Only one of them showed back up this past season. I only know of one of them that was killed. On average 4 out of 5 years, I will have at least one buck that is at least 4.5 years old on camera fairly frequently. I think a big factor in my situation is the neighbor behind me has a little over 1,000 acres and very few bucks are killed on that 1,000 acres, some years no bucks are killed. He will not shoot a deer under 150 regardless of age. That is not a reasonable expectation for me. I am looking for a mature deer regardless of score, which I can accomplish like I said, 4 out of 5 years. Some years, 2 out of 5 years on average, I kill two that meet the 4.5 or older criteria. Last year I mistakenly killed a 3.5 yr old.
 
Mattt said:
I learned something this year relates to this. Cell cams acting up so put two on same spot. New camera picking up deer moving behind old one. Ithink they didn't like the camera and moved just far enough to feel comfy in a main travel corridor.
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I've watched deer learning to skirt a trail-camera with a visible flash. If they can see it, they will avoid it.
 
Hillbilly Hunter said:
Great post and from my experience, this is 100% accurate. I had eight 9 pters last year that were 2 1/2 and 3 1/2 years old. Out of those 8 bucks Only one of them showed back up this past season. I only know of one of them that was killed. On average 4 out of 5 years, I will have at least one buck that is at least 4.5 years old on camera fairly frequently. I think a big factor in my situation is the neighbor behind me has a little over 1,000 acres and very few bucks are killed on that 1,000 acres, some years no bucks are killed. He will not shoot a deer under 150 regardless of age. That is not a reasonable expectation for me. I am looking for a mature deer regardless of score, which I can accomplish like I said, 4 out of 5 years. Some years, 2 out of 5 years on average, I kill two that meet the 4.5 or older criteria. Last year I mistakenly killed a 3.5 yr old.
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Thank you for your comments. You are very lucky to have such a great place. Have fun, be safe and enjoy. Good luck.
 
Rob-HC Hunter said:
I think it is multiple factors to include: pressure, farm sustainability, cover, food, killed by other hunters, hit by vehicles, natural causes, etc etc.

We recently found a target buck dead on our farm. Suspect he was shot by a neighbor and died on our farm. If we hadn't walked up on him we would have been scratching our heads wondering what happened to him.
View attachment 210187

View attachment 210188
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Just out of curiosity, would you have let the hunter who shot him, retrieve him, had he asked?

That will make a nice Euro mount, but seems a waste of good venison.
 
Lt.Dan said:
Just out of curiosity, would you have let the hunter who shot him, retrieve him, had he asked?

That will make a nice Euro mount, but seems a waste of good venison.
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Even though we are very strict about trespassing we totally would allowed someone to look for or retrieve their deer.
 
Rob-HC Hunter said:
Even though we are very strict about trespassing we totally would allowed someone to look for or retrieve their deer.
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Glad to hear that. I get posting the land but I don't get it when someone shoots a deer on their property and it runs over the border to someone else's and they won't let the deer be recovered. Kudos to you and yours for allowing if they would have asked. You're a true sportsman.
 
Lt.Dan said:
Glad to hear that. I get posting the land but I don't get it when someone shoots a deer on their property and it runs over the border to someone else's and they won't let the deer be recovered. Kudos to you and yours for allowing if they would have asked. You're a true sportsman.
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Thanks Lt. Dan. I would want the same respect if I killed one that went on their place.
 

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