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Why do turkey hunters miss/wound their gobbler?

I'll get blasted for this but when I switched to TSS I never partnered my gun after I switched. I have patterned it with other loads years ago and it always shot the same so I didn't see the need to with TSS. And as far as shooting one thing I've always done is I always try and make a note or sound just before I shoot and I don't squeeze the trigger i punch it. Some
Probably won't agree with my methods but they work for me I've always been a good judge of distance I laugh at people who say they missed then discovered a bird was 60-70 yards. That's ridiculous. My bead on my 870 would nearly cover a bird at that distance 50 yards is a looooong shot to me. I think the reason most miss is inexperience or they're just too desperate to shoot at one. I've let plenty of gobblers go at 60-70 just for having discipline and not wanting to chance wounding/crippling one.
 
I lost count on the number of birds I "missed" when I first started turkey hunting. My problem was flinching and not keeping my head down. Luckily my dad decided to try a scope one year. I had one on my gun shortly after trying his out. I won't turkey hunt without a scope on my guns now. Every year we check our scopes with the loads we use to hunt with. A scope also makes it a lot easier for wives and kids. My 5 year old and my wife both do really well shooting one of my turkey guns.
 
Everything SCN stated can cause one not to kill a Gobbler "clean". That being said, I don't care what anyone claims, other than the occasional under 10yrd shot, very few Gobblers escape a trigger pull without taking several "hits". Unfortunately, this leads many to dying a slow, miserable death. Eroding ethics, combined with this TSS horsesh#t, will continue to make things worse.
 
I don't have a lot to add because most has already been said, but . . . . .

1) One of the main reasons some hunters miss close, "easy" shots is because they've bought into the idea of very tight rifle-like chokes that can enable them to make longer-range kills. The "con" of this is it makes you more likely to completely miss the close "easy" shots.

I've said this many times, the average turkey hunter would likely come home with more turkeys if he was using a more open choke, instead of the extra-extra full "turkey" chokes so many are using WITHOUT the aid of an optical sight.

2) Optical sights can eliminate the potential for most misses (if bird within range).

3) Since recoil is usually an issue with flinching, autoloading shotguns have less recoil than the others.

4) The difference in felt recoil of a 1 1/2 oz or less load, and a 2 oz or higher payload, is almost beyond comparison. Just a little more payload, like opting for 1 3/4 oz instead of 2 oz, can significantly reduce felt recoil. And going up to 2 1/4 oz may recoil so bad you fear ever pulling the trigger again.

5) Another related issue is one's own eyes.
As we get older, our eyes tend to not work as well as when we were younger.
In particular, our eyes' abilities to quickly focus back & forth from a target to the sight gets worse.
At some point or age, you may find you can either clearly see your sight or the target, but not both near simultaneously. This is the point at which you NEED an optical sight for no other reason than your eye issue, but that optical sight will greatly help you shoot more accurately as well.

Traditional low-magnification optics work best for elder eyes.
Most of the red-dots scope (including the Burris Fastfire) do not have the ability to adjust specifically to your eyes, although they can be light years ahead of a shotgun bead or "iron" rifle sights.
 
cowhunter71 said:
. . . . other than the occasional under 10yrd shot, very few Gobblers escape a trigger pull without taking several "hits". Unfortunately, this leads many to dying a slow, miserable death. Eroding ethics, combined with this TSS horsesh#t, will continue to make things worse.
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I agree that many presumed "misses" are not misses, the bird gets a single pellet in the gut, and dies a painful death over the next few days, while the hunter presumes he musta missed because the bird flew off.

But I don't think this problem should be blamed on TSS. Instead, the problem is more about hunters taking low-probability shots, and not understanding range limitations.

Contributing to this are choke & shell marketers promoting long-range turkey shooting rather than turkey hunting. Winchester lead "Longbeards" marketing has been as bad as any marketer of TSS in promoting long-range turkey sniping?

Also, regarding "flyer" pellets straying outside a presumed pattern, this is actually worse with lead than with TSS. IMO, an ethical hunter using TSS will wound fewer turkeys than one using lead, due to TSS throwing more uniform, denser patterns, having fewer "fliers".
 
fairchaser said:
I don't understand this analogy unless you're talking about shooting too far. Otherwise, treating a shotgun like a rifle as far as aiming precisely is a good practice.
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Trying to put 681 pellets in a 10" circle at 40 yards while saying I limit my shots out to 40 yards was primarily what I'm talking about.

Although shotguns treated like rifles generally create comments like "I didn't have my gun up", "He wouldn't hold still", "He came in on my wrong side", "I wasn't ready, "My scope was fogged up". All comments similar to those you hear from deer hunters.

To each their own but I shoot turkeys just like squirrels, rabbits and even ducks if need be. I'm just saying with todays pellet counts especially with TSS, I think turkey guns are way over thought if your really shooting out to 40-45 yards.
 
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TheLBLman said:
I agree that many presumed "misses" are not misses, the bird gets a single pellet in the gut, and dies a painful death over the next few days, while the hunter presumes he musta missed because the bird flew off.

But I don't think this problem should be blamed on TSS. Instead, the problem is more about hunters taking low-probability shots, and not understanding range limitations.

Contributing to this are choke & shell marketers promoting long-range turkey shooting rather than turkey hunting. Winchester lead "Longbeards" marketing has been as bad as any marketer of TSS in promoting long-range turkey sniping?

Also, regarding "flyer" pellets straying outside a presumed pattern, this is actually worse with lead than with TSS. IMO, an ethical hunter using TSS will wound fewer turkeys than one using lead, due to TSS throwing more uniform, denser patterns, having fewer "fliers".
Click to expand...
Exactly I don't know a single person who buys TSS to shoot turkeys at greater distances.. TSS gives you a much better pattern even with a sub gauge, a more forgiving pattern and a cleaner kill. Ignorance is bliss I guess..
 
Levee Jumper said:
Trying to put 681 pellets in a 10" circle at 40 yards while saying I limit my shots out to 40 yards was primarily what I'm talking about.

Although shotguns treated like rifles generally create comments like "I didn't have my gun up", "He wouldn't hold still", "He came in on my wrong side", "I wasn't ready, "My scope was fogged up". All comments similar to those you hear from deer hunters.

To each their own but I shoot turkeys just like squirrels, rabbits and even ducks if need be. I'm just saying with todays pellet counts especially with TSS, I think turkey guns are way over thought if your really shooting out to 40-45 yards.
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In other words, a shotgun is a pointing gun and not an aiming gun? Ok I guess on a turkey the kill zone is pretty small so I have a tendency to aim rather than point especially with tight patterns. But that's just me.
 
TheLBLman said:
But I don't think this problem should be blamed on TSS. Instead, the problem is more about hunters taking low-probability shots, and not understanding range limitations.

Contributing to this are choke & shell marketers promoting long-range turkey shooting rather than turkey hunting. Winchester lead "Longbeards" marketing has been as bad as any marketer of TSS in promoting long-range turkey sniping?

Also, regarding "flyer" pellets straying outside a presumed pattern, this is actually worse with lead than with TSS. IMO, an ethical hunter using TSS will wound fewer turkeys than one using lead, due to TSS throwing more uniform, denser patterns, having fewer "fliers".
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Excellent, excellent post. Saying TSS is the problem is like blaming the AR-15 for a mass shooting. No AR-15 has ever made someone kill someone else, and no TSS shell has ever made a hunter take an unethical shot. Hunters that take unethical shots will do it regardless of what's in the gun. If anything I would argue not using the most deadly and best patterning ammo available would be more unethical than using it.
 
fairchaser said:
In other words, a shotgun is a pointing gun and not an aiming gun? Ok I guess on a turkey the kill zone is pretty small so I have a tendency to aim rather than point especially with tight patterns. But that's just me.
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I aim at sitting squirrels, cripple ducks on the water, and stationary turkeys. I point at flying and running critters.

You already knew that though.
 
TheLBLman said:
I agree that many presumed "misses" are not misses, the bird gets a single pellet in the gut, and dies a painful death over the next few days, while the hunter presumes he musta missed because the bird flew off.

But I don't think this problem should be blamed on TSS. Instead, the problem is more about hunters taking low-probability shots, and not understanding range limitations.

Contributing to this are choke & shell marketers promoting long-range turkey shooting rather than turkey hunting. Winchester lead "Longbeards" marketing has been as bad as any marketer of TSS in promoting long-range turkey sniping?

Also, regarding "flyer" pellets straying outside a presumed pattern, this is actually worse with lead than with TSS. IMO, an ethical hunter using TSS will wound fewer turkeys than one using lead, due to TSS throwing more uniform, denser patterns, having fewer "fliers".
Click to expand...
Spot on about lack of fliers. I duplex steel/TSS for ducks and geese and shoot it through a cylinder choke. Without the steel on top to help disrupt the TSS, the Tungsten is scary tight even through the cylinder choke.
 
scn said:
#3 on flinching:

It takes some range time to correct. Shooting some reduced recoil shells can help a lot. Doing the drill with the dummy shells and someone else loading you up is also a help in staying on the target.

For kids, I really like the idea of using low recoil game loads to practice, and then hunting with the heavier load. Most don't feel the recoil when they are actually shooting at the gobbler.

Opening up the pattern where you have a broader span of shot rather than the most shot in a 10" circle that has somehow become the name of the game will help with actually killing some birds. Paper punching is needed to know your gun, but it often doesn't correlate to actually getting the job done.

Anyway, nothing earth shattering in any of this. Just trying to help some of our newbies realize some of their dreams. Hope everyone has a SAFE and productive season.
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We used the dummy rounds a lot on our pistol training. You can always tell people will drop the barrel I found most of the time when anticipating recoil with a sidearm.
 
Also when I pattern my guns I have a slip on limbsaver pad and I wear one those recoil pads on my shoulder also. No point in taking a beating if you don't have to. Did the same thing in the Army when shooting our .300 win mag and Barrett .50 cal.

One thing I learned also is to put a kisser button on the gun. This helps you with cheek weld, sight alignment and will also help to keep your cheek down on the stock. All you need is an airsoft bb and some moleskin.
 
cowhunter71 said:
Anyone who thinks 90% of the asshats shooting TSS, are not indeed doing so, solely because they think it allows them to take ridiculous 60+yards shots, has their head up their ass. ;)
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I agree 100%. I shoot 3.5 inch TSS in a 12 gauge with a lengthened forcing cone, Jellyhead choke, and a Leupold turkey scope so I can cleanly kill them at 75 yards, but I was getting too many pellets in the breasts. I limit my shots to 60 yards now. Anyone that shoots past 60 is unethical and doesn't care about wasting meat.
 
cowhunter71 said:
Anyone who thinks 90% of the asshats shooting TSS, are not indeed doing so, solely because they think it allows them to take ridiculous 60+yards shots, has their head up their ass. ;)
Click to expand...
My old 835 set up could kill at 60. I know because I killed one at that range on accident. Got set up and he came in quick before I could range some landmarks and I thought he was maybe 45. Ended up he was 57 if I remember correctly. Point is you don't need TSS to kill at that distance if that's your cup of tea. I prefer 40 and in regardless of what the shell is.
 

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