For those that have been falling into .........

[Setterman]

I see but here's what Ive seen over the last few weeks some (me included) have seen a decline in what USED to be gobble filled hills and hollows want a change and want to address the issues, while on the other hand some still have those hollows that are filled with gobbles are totally against a change.

I range a broad area and none of them are filled with anything but silence. I'm personally for slashing the fall seasons, and dropping our limit back to two. Dropping to 3 won't make any difference unless you outlaw jake harvests as well.

Try something more restrictive to see if the trend reverses itself

 

[TNTomtaker01]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

 

[callemquacktn]

Question if I may but, why are we arguin over which state kills more birds?

It wasn't meant to be about that. A few on here were making a comparison of our state against Ky saying they were ahead of us in quality of hunting. It got me to wondering if they really had something on us here in tn.
Then I showed ky has actually been in a slightly bigger decline than us in the last 5 yrs. Can't figure out why you would want to compare us to a state doing just as bad.

 

[callemquacktn]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

From my observation turkeys have not used fields the last 2 yrs as in yrs past. Birds are still there just not being visible

 

[catman529]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

the chicken crap and/or other unexplained declines concern me a lot more than over harvest. The agency can at least address over harvest if enough people complain about it and harvests go down, but what can we do about something mysteriously killing off huge flocks of hundreds of birds?


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[TNTomtaker01]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

From my observation turkeys have not used fields the last 2 yrs as in yrs past. Birds are still there just not being visible

I agree with the lack of field use also but these aces don't have large tracts of timber that can keep a bird hidden all day.

 

[TNTomtaker01]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

the chicken crap and/or other unexplained declines concern me a lot more than over harvest. The agency can at least address over harvest if enough people complain about it and harvests go down, but what can we do about something mysteriously killing off huge flocks of hundreds of birds?


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That's libda what I'm getting at i agree the limits need to be changed to help the population back from the decline but, I think it's something besides over harvest that is the problem.

 

[ZachMarkus]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

the chicken crap and/or other unexplained declines concern me a lot more than over harvest. The agency can at least address over harvest if enough people complain about it and harvests go down, but what can we do about something mysteriously killing off huge flocks of hundreds of birds?

That's what I'd like to know. Something happened to all of ours and a lot of farms around ours turkeys in one single year, I swear that next spring it was the talk of Lawrence county, no one had any birds at all.


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[scn]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

the chicken crap and/or other unexplained declines concern me a lot more than over harvest. The agency can at least address over harvest if enough people complain about it and harvests go down, but what can we do about something mysteriously killing off huge flocks of hundreds of birds?


Sent from the talk of tap

That's libda what I'm getting at i agree the limits need to be changed to help the population back from the decline but, I think it's something besides over harvest that is the problem.

I have no doubts at all that something more than over harvest has caused the decline. However, it make ZERO sense to me to continue to hammer the birds at the same level as when we had historic highs and even turkey depredation issues in some middle TN areas. Perhaps by stopping the hen killing and cutting back on the spring harvest the decline can be slowed a little until they can figure out the main issues for the decline and possibly address them.

 

[deerchaser007]

Yes, ky is declining also. Their last year of a successful hen per poult ratio was 08 from what I have saw and numbers I can find. 08 was 3.8 hpp, the following years were 1.8 to 2.0. I did read a article that said 2012 was above 3 again, but cannot confirm that with ky data. But yes, they are experiencing the same issue as the rest of the south, production is to low to stabilize the population. TN has just been on a downhill slide much longer in stable hpp ratios.

 

[PickettSFHunter]

Dead hens don't lay eggs! One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

the chicken crap and/or other unexplained declines concern me a lot more than over harvest. The agency can at least address over harvest if enough people complain about it and harvests go down, but what can we do about something mysteriously killing off huge flocks of hundreds of birds?


Sent from the talk of tap

That's libda what I'm getting at i agree the limits need to be changed to help the population back from the decline but, I think it's something besides over harvest that is the problem.

I have no doubts at all that something more than over harvest has caused the decline. However, it make ZERO sense to me to continue to hammer the birds at the same level as when we had historic highs and even turkey depredation issues in some middle TN areas. Perhaps by stopping the hen killing and cutting back on the spring harvest the decline can be slowed a little until they can figure out the main issues for the decline and possibly address them.

. Yep! I think that's what we are trying to say. Why continue blasting away in the face of uncertainty.


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[Andy S.]

Word is Bama is considering a drop to 3 birds from 5 to address their problem

South Carolina is doing the same next year, reducing bag limit from 5 to 3. The links below will shed some light on why they are taking that approach.

2013 link, but it tells the tale (poor recruitment, more hunters, less harvest)
http://www.dnr.sc.gov/wildlife/turkey/baglimits13.html

2014 link
http://www.southcarolinasportsman.com/d ... hp?id=3662

2014 Brood Survey
http://www.dnr.sc.gov/wildlife/turkey/2 ... urvey.html

Hot off the press link addressing the decline in SC and changes on the horizon
http://www.edgefieldadvertiser.com/2015 ... next-year/

I suspect that the problem is more widespread than the state line of TN, which many of you have eluded to.

 

[woodsman87]

I dont have experience in anywhere but Tennessee and Alabama.
I do not think south Alabama, lets say south of I-20, is even having a decline at all. Also the north eastern mountain areas are still pretty good.

Alabama has had a five bird limit for a long long time, and most of the state has had a 40-45 day season for a long long time, and about five of the best turkey counties have had fall seasons for a long time.
What I am getting at is, turkey hunting is a way of life down there, and even though the high limits and lots of hunting pressure, most areas seem to be thriving with birds. Because it is a way of life, and so dear to their hearts, lots of them do habitat management work for turkeys so in turn they will have more turkeys to shoot.

Since I have lived up here, I have wondered why so many more people do not do their part in helping the wild turkey. Lots of people complain about being no birds,lots of people put out crack corn pre-season, but hardly anyone actually promotes good nesting and brooding habitat like they do in southern Alabama.

My goals up here has been to try and improve every land that I have access too, for the benefit of turkeys.
Turkey hunting just isn't a way of life here like select other places. I wish it were.

With high limits, more sportsmen may consider putting more effort to improve habitats so that they and their family and friends can have better turkey hunting. If there were only 2 bird limits, lots of people would not put forth any effort at all to promote turkey habitat, because two birds for the outrageous license prices may not be worth it.

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[woodsman87]

Although my opinions were swayed to lower limits with some of these Kentucky vs. Tennessee threads, after reading all of y'alls comments, and seeing the harvest data from several years of both states, I have moved my opinion back to nesting success. I have no idea honestly what is going on in Kentucky, or most of Tennessee. I am confined to Wayne, Lawrence, Lincoln, and Giles. There is a real decline down here, and I do not believe over harvest is the reason. Over harvest certainly hasn't come from my self. It was like the spring of 06 and 07 there where birds on every property, and after the seasons they were still there. But by the time the 08 fall/winter flock break up, there was not many turkeys at all.

I still do not believe chicken litter killed them, although it could be a possibility. Hogs and armidillos burst onto the scene around some of these places in 2007-2008. We have always had coyotes, possums, foxes, coons, bobcats, hawks, and owls.

I still believe that the decline in southern middle Tennessee is a combination of unfortunately and uncontrollable bad spring nesting weather, loss of nesting habitat due to housing developments, more ag fields instead of cow pasture, a long with predation.

It isn't over harvest, it isn't fall seasons, although hen killing should be outlawed immediately, it sure as hell isn't helping.

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[Andy S.]

....I have wondered why so many more people do not do their part in helping the wild turkey.

IMO, the majority of turkey hunters do NOT own the land they hunt on, thus they have no control over the long term (sold for development, leased out from under them, etc), thus they will not invest funds that may not directly help them over time. Some may view this as a selfish stance to take on the issue, but I'd bet a fair amount of money this is the REAL reason many hunters do not do more to promote habitat.

 

[TheLBLman]

One thing that worries me is there are three 300+ acre farms that I drive by that no longer consistently have the large number of birds that they did just last year. No hunting is allowed on these places I'm sure some trespassing may happen but why have these birds disappeared?

I'm sure there are many reasons our turkey population is in a decline, but regarding this specific question (around a 300-acre) farm, I'd say the main reason is Tom turkeys don't limit themselves to 300 acres. I've personally watched (undisturbed) longbeards travel over a mile down a ridgeline in about an hour's time, and this is in "ridge & hollow" type terrain where nearby cover was abundant in every direction (as was food sources). One square mile is 640 acres. Two square miles is 2,560 acres.

I believe turkeys (and deer) regularly cover a lot more acreage than most hunters assume. Those same birds you may be thinking of as "yours" on your 300-acre farm, well, there's another guy whose nearest property boundary may be over a half-mile from yours, yet he's seeing those very same birds as "his". Often, both hunters, unbeknown to each other, decide to only take 2 or 3 of those 4 longbeards they've been seeing. Often, few to none survive that area, and this year's surviving jakes become next year's longbeards. This has always been an issue, but as more people have recently taken up turkey hunting, with more effective longer-range guns, more effective tactics, over-harvest is becoming a greater concern.

 

[TheLBLman]

If there were only 2 bird limits, lots of people would not put forth any effort at all to promote turkey habitat, because two birds for the outrageous license prices may not be worth it.

I have to disagree with that notion, noting that the vast majority of Tennessee's turkey hunters do not even kill "a" turkey, despite the current limit being 4 birds.

 

[woodsman87]

If there were only 2 bird limits, lots of people would not put forth any effort at all to promote turkey habitat, because two birds for the outrageous license prices may not be worth it.

I have to disagree with that notion, noting that the vast majority of Tennessee's turkey hunters do not even kill "a" turkey, despite the current limit being 4 birds.

Because it isn't a way of life to them. Most people worry about deer anyways.





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[woodsman87]

I am not including public land hunters or hunters that have no control over what they hunt. Some people complain about no birds on their land, yet they do nothing to help.
Many people would be more successful if they'd try to promote turkey habitat.

If I didnt do anything on what I've got, there wouldn't be a bird within 7 miles of mre.

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[benellivol]

Open up a hawk season, that will surely help poults survive