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Longer season ? Cwd related
- Thread starter timberjack86
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UpperTully
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Grant money from the government I would presume.
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In Illinois, depending on county we have two additional "CWD seasons"
There is no mandatory check in and sampling like regular gun season.
Seems pointless.
There is no mandatory check in and sampling like regular gun season.
Seems pointless.
Sure this will stir a lot of negative responses, but this is my observation and opinion. I see far fewer deer on my 150 acres than I did 10 years ago. In fact, maybe as much as 25% of the deer I saw when I purchased my farm in 2004. My surrounding farms and area has not changed, but aggressive harvest numbers have. SO.....
I would love to see Unit L reduce the doe harvest number to 1 per day and end the season before the New Year begins. Working as a Forestry Tech, I see a lot of timber and farms around Henry, Benton, Carroll, Weakley, Obion, etc. I have not seen drastic evidence of browse damage or over-population. Farmers will disagree with this opinion as deer eat away profits.
I would love to see Unit L reduce the doe harvest number to 1 per day and end the season before the New Year begins. Working as a Forestry Tech, I see a lot of timber and farms around Henry, Benton, Carroll, Weakley, Obion, etc. I have not seen drastic evidence of browse damage or over-population. Farmers will disagree with this opinion as deer eat away profits.
That defeats the purpose. Nobody would hunt. Plus depending on the timetable bucks would be dropping already. There would be a lot of mature bucks killed because the hunter thought it was a doe or didn't care.
BSK
Well-Known Member
The current state of "science," and I'm using that term loosely. The hubris that Man with his powerful brain has all the answers.
I'm like you muddy boots. This mentality will ruin deer hunting. I'm in the heart of the red zone with this CWD. None of us are buying into the kill 'em all mentality. This post is one of the few I've seen that agrees with TWRA on this. Thankfully it's not more!
I feel like the biggest reason for a declining herd in our area is mostly the farmers. They'll clear ever tree and bush off of an area to get another row in. Take that along with the farmers shooting deer all summer long our population can't rebound. CWD may kill a few but I promise you it's a much smaller amount then the farmers are doing. But then again that's TWRA giving the farmers permits and then telling everyone to kill every deer they can because of CWD. Maybe if we ever found any dead deer I could buy into the whole CWD thing. But for now psssh!
you definitely misunderstood me or I suck at trying to get a opinion across. I just feel most deer will be killed in November what few are killed in January will not amount to much. Yes I feel deer spread this , I feel it's in every county already and I think it's been here longer than people Realize . So if you shoot couple 100 more not really going to amount to much. Look at the private land hunt in January anterless only hunt not a lot killed compared to opening day of muzzle loader or rifle. I personally feel the August hunt hurts some people more than it benefits the majority. But I never gripe anyway this is a real thing and probably spread in August really bad over all the bait piles that have been put out for the August hunt.
Agree. So lets just leave it alone.
DeerCamp
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I'm curious - but do the 2021 harvest numbers indicate that we are killing more deer?
I have one main beef, and that is the 3X does a day limit. There has to be an upper limit somewhere.
If I wanted to, I could decimate our local deer population, 100% legally. No single hunter should be able to do that
I have one main beef, and that is the 3X does a day limit. There has to be an upper limit somewhere.
If I wanted to, I could decimate our local deer population, 100% legally. No single hunter should be able to do that
I've always felt the 3-does-a-day was mainly a way of the TWRA convincing hunters it is okay to shoot does. I don't expect that a large number of hunters actually kill 3 does on any given day so changing it to 2 per day or even 1 per day may not make much of a difference except psychologically.
One-a-day still allows a hunter to kill 100 or so in a season. Most hunters have a personal limit and won't kill more than what they want to keep and maybe some extra to donate to others. I also think this is a big reason for the 5-day antlerless hunt at the end of the season. A hunter that wants only one or one additional deer but wants a buck at the same time will pass up does; if the hunter doesn't get that buck then the 5-day hunt can be used to get some meat for the freezer. Some people don't want a huge amount of deer meat. The 5-day hunt isn't very flexible though since it is on weekdays and a couple of days of bad weather can really screw it up.
I'd like to know the numbers of deer killed using the agriculture exemptions. Someone probably has numbers on multiple deer kills by individual hunters during the season as well which would show how much the seasonal limit really comes into play.
One-a-day still allows a hunter to kill 100 or so in a season. Most hunters have a personal limit and won't kill more than what they want to keep and maybe some extra to donate to others. I also think this is a big reason for the 5-day antlerless hunt at the end of the season. A hunter that wants only one or one additional deer but wants a buck at the same time will pass up does; if the hunter doesn't get that buck then the 5-day hunt can be used to get some meat for the freezer. Some people don't want a huge amount of deer meat. The 5-day hunt isn't very flexible though since it is on weekdays and a couple of days of bad weather can really screw it up.
I'd like to know the numbers of deer killed using the agriculture exemptions. Someone probably has numbers on multiple deer kills by individual hunters during the season as well which would show how much the seasonal limit really comes into play.
BSK
Well-Known Member
I agree completely. The 3-antlerless per day limit was set for psychological reasons - to let hunters know it was OK to shoot does. Of course the Agency doesn't expect anyone to actually kill that many does (and it would be impossible to do so for long), but my question is, how far would hunters like to see the limit dropped until they see it as "reasonable?" At what point would a limit actually be limiting anyone?
BSK
Well-Known Member
This is a big one for me. I would like to know how many depredation permits were issued and where. And how many deer were actually killed with the permits. I hear hunters saying farmers are killing all the deer, but I would like to see just how big of a problem this really is.
DoubleRidge
Well-Known Member
Small sample but I know six families that truly farm for a living...or it's at least a significant portion of their income.
One of them applied for depredation permits and was given the green light to kill deer as needed......and he proceeded to hammer the does....can't remember the number killed but it was dozens and dozens of does....he gave away as many as he could and drug the rest off into the woods.....he said it was a never ending battle and a bunch of work....he also mentioned that it helped for a couple of years ...but 4 or 5 years later and he can barely tell the difference......he has since invested in an electric fence system for two of his fields and he now purchases a portion of the products he needs for his clients (argi-tourism)....but most I know who farm for a living don't have time to sit and shoot deer daily.... yeah...they kill a few....but enough to really have an impact? No......I've heard stories of areas wiped out by depredation permit holders....but it's hard for me to wrap my mind around how much time, effort and energy would be invested in trying to eradicate a deer herd? My guess is if the predation permit data was available the impact would be very localized verses widespread.....but I'll also say.....my comments are based off living in middle TN..... the situation in West TN may be different.
BSK
Well-Known Member
My thoughts exactly DoubleRidge. The effects must be localized. I'm in a big ag area for my region, and I know of no one - NO ONE - utilizing depredation permits.
I don't think the TWRA wants us to "kill them all". The same thing was said about the 3 deer a day in unit L. Like you said, it was for psychological reasons. I think the same for the CWD regs. They want the heard thinned to slow the spread. Now how much is too much is the question. Were too many deer killed as part of the unit L regs? And are too many being killed as part of the CWD regs. I personally think CWD is thinning the heard just like Unit L was intended. We just need to figure out if we, in combination with CWD, are killing too many deer. Pretty sure its a balancing act.
BSK
Well-Known Member
I agree BigAl. Let's say deer kill numbers are constantly falling. But why? Is it less deer? Is it fewer hunters? Is it pickier hunters? Is it CWD? Without some good data, no one knows. I sure wish the TWRA still conducted the late summer thermal imaging censuses. That methodology isn't perfect, but it's a heck of a lot better data than nothing. I would love to see some mortality studies conducted as well. I strongly suspect CWD is killing few deer. It appears many infected deer live to advanced ages, and since bucks are infected at a much higher rate than does, few bucks live to advanced ages anyways. Now CWD is certainly infecting and affecting a considerable number of deer, but deer dying in droves? I bet not. In study after study, the leading cause of mortality in white-tailed deer is found to be hunter's legal bullets and arrows. Legal hunting accounts for more dead deer than cars or endemic disease (outside of a big local EHD outbreak), or accidental death or animal predators. The one caveat would be high fawn mortality to coyotes in some areas.
You'll never get an accurate number on this sadly. Reason I blame the farmers is from what I've been told by them. 5 yrs ago a farmer we had on one place by July 2nd had already killed 62 deer. This was on 232 acres. Another one I know along with his sons had killed over 200 last Summer. He farms about 4.000 acres. Another farmer farming close to me would only tell me " a lot of deer". He farms about 1.500 acres. I hear these stories from others as well. These are Summer time kills. These numbers are from only one Summer! This isn't multiple years kill totals. This happens every Summer around here. A lot are pregnant doe and then motherless fawns are left as well. It's not all ethical hunters and CWD wiping them out. I've had farmers want to add my name to their permits. I tell them I'm not interested. But that's my opinion. Fayette and Hardeman counties are big farming areas. We don't have hills and mountains that can be left out of farming. Every piece of ground you can put a bean on is planted. If it's not it's cleared off so they can. Our cover is gone now. You don't see CRP land around here like you did 15 years ago. Hunters can't even get a foodplot in because of nothing left. It's a whole different ballgame now.
I think you'd understand more if you could get Fayette and Hardeman counties GW's to tell us how many eradication permits they give out a year. It would be self explanatory then. It's truly mind blowing when you hear it. Sorry for the rant but it's a touchy subject in our area.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the input 7mmWSM. Definitely a regional thing.
