I have a guy setting up a portable saw mill and i am going to save what i can. I have way more than i can ever get out. Great info on the vines, thanks.
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Managing your own land
- Thread starter BSK
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BSK
Well-Known Member
I'm so envious Ski. We have so much downed timber laying around. A shame it can't be used for anything. Always wished I had/knew how to do my own milling. But thousands of board feet of White, Red and Chestnut Oak laying around rotting.
MickThompson
Well-Known Member
I had an area like this but it was loblolly. I chainsawed trails through it to make the area passable and it's a great spot to get buck pictures, I just haven't figured out how to hunt it yet.
Don't be envious. Get a saw! Seriously the best investment I've ever made in terms of managing a timber property. I paid about $6k for mine but you can get them starting at around $3k, or you can spend way more. Mine is on the large side of manual. It can handle & cut a big log but I've got to be able to get it on there. The ATV/UTV log arch skidder makes things pretty easy with logs up to about 24". Any bigger than that and you'd want something more substantial.
Milling is quite easy. There's a learning curve but it's not rocket science. Get a saw that has a common blade length and is easy to work with. Mine is a very common size and almost everything on the saw can be replaced with locally sourced or Amazon parts. I promise you do not have to be a lumberjack to use one. It's pretty darn straight forward and you'd enjoy it more than you can imagine. Plus you'll have all kinds of friends & family you never knew you had, wanting lumber! Good thing about oaks is that it takes decades to rot. It might look rotten on the outside but just an inch or two in it will be rock solid. You got time. I seriously recommend it, though. If you need any help with anything don't hesitate to ask. I don't think I'm all that far from you, and it doesn't take much excuse for me to go play in the woods!
BSK
Well-Known Member
Hahaha I understand that. But it doesn't have to be a hobby. It's a tool to minimize loss from dead falls, while supplying yourself with lumber that is always handy to have around the farm. Mine goes years at times without use, but when I need it I'm sure happy to have it.
This table was made from a big old white oak from my place. Wasn't worth much as a lumber log but it was large so I milled it up and gave some of the lumber to my aunt who has a prominent pizza place in the nearby town. She had it turned into a table and sign. The table is called "the family table" and is quite popular for families & larger groups. It stays reserved. Below that is a pic of some porch posts made from cedar logs. Turned out pretty dang nice and gets lots of attention. Tons of stuff like that came from me cleaning up dead falls & such on my place through the years. Otherwise it would just lay to rot. I'm cleaning up a mess anyway so rather than let rot or pile it up for a bonfire, it's neat seeing it put to use.
If that log dolly ever gets in your way I could store it for you... though honestly I really need mules for much of where I need to get logs down.Yes ash trees can be DEADLY when cutting dead standing trees because the grain structure allows them to break off at a 90*, so there's no warning noise from it twisting & peeling as it snaps. It'll just flat break straight across and fall. I've been two years cutting as many of my saw log ash & milling them into lumber before it all rots away. It's a chore. I feel like I'm in a race against time. I hate losing them but I'm getting plenty good lumber for siding, lathing, fencing, and woodwork tinkering. Having a sawmill sure is handy.
As for the vines, they are indeed grapes. And they can get HUGE. Don't ever cut a tree with vines still attached at the ground because they'll dictate where it falls regardless of how you hinged it. Get rid of them before dropping a tree. My state forester came to the property and instructed me on how to deal with them in terms of management. He said to cut them at both the ground and at chest height. This ensures you'll know it's been cut as you can clearly see the cut from a distance. One thing he insisted for wildlife was to leave vines alone in junk trees because the grapes are a critical food for birds and rodents. Literally every critter in the forest eats them. For any tree that is or potentially could become a timber value, cut the vines as instructed. He also said no herbicide necessary because once cut they're dead.
Here are a couple pics from this summer. I cut & milled dozens of dead ash and barely made a dent. Lots of work yet to do. The wood inside the big ones is beautiful, though! Rivals any of the rosewoods I've worked with from anywhere in the world. I used it for shed siding, and cherry for shed floor lol. When you're milling & building all at same time you use what you cut. Of course the old guys have to be present for supervisory & technical support
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Break Break
BP/Charcoal makers:
I mostly leave the grape vines alone but will collect a bunch this year while thinning/clearing/selecting saw logs to test for charcoal in homemade/use BP. Hear it is as good/better than willow for charcoal.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Stop! Stop! STOP!!! You're going to get me interested!
Hahaha I've got two! They are quite handy for more than just dragging logs. I was surprised at how much I use them to drag tree tops out for strategic placement to create temporary screening or cover. I even pull them out in front of tree stands so deer not only don't come sniffing around my tree but also don't see me approaching it. I also use them to drag firewood logs up next to the firewood pile so I don't have to load & unload firewood one stick at a time. My buck this year was so heavy I seriously contemplated hooking him up to the log arch & dragging him like that, but my dad convinced me to man handle it up into the bed of the UTV. My back still hurts.
I've never heard that about grape vine charcoal. Super interesting!
I used to load my Band Saw Mill (LT15) into the back off a full size pickup by myself. Push head to one end, pull truck to other end. Pickup light end and set on tail gate. Back up truck very carefully then push head up till the rails popped up with the head now solid & balanced in the bed, then either push the whole deal all the way in or carefully back up with the rails against a convenient tree to force everything forward. Now that is no longer an option, would take a week to recover, if, I didn't destroy the sawmiil or truck trying...but I am sure you can find a young man or someone with help who could come and saw.
The point is, that anyone with a portable mill could probably come and do a little cutting for you, or even let them come and take what they cut. In the process the demonstration would end up proving the worth of the sawmill to you. No more excuses, another required tool in your inventory...
Always happy to be a bad influence for a good thing... Just blame Ski (preferred) or last resort blame Rock, heck any excuse will do...
On the serious side, expanding what Ski said, if you got lots of trees, a sawmill or an on call sawyer is the next level of effective utilization and management of the resource...
The point is, that anyone with a portable mill could probably come and do a little cutting for you, or even let them come and take what they cut. In the process the demonstration would end up proving the worth of the sawmill to you. No more excuses, another required tool in your inventory...
Always happy to be a bad influence for a good thing... Just blame Ski (preferred) or last resort blame Rock, heck any excuse will do...
On the serious side, expanding what Ski said, if you got lots of trees, a sawmill or an on call sawyer is the next level of effective utilization and management of the resource...
I'll take the blame. I think anybody who has a decent wooded property should have one. I seriously cannot think of a tool I've been so happy to have. I mean think about it. Most folks have a mess when a storm comes through and they lose trees that could have been worth money. But if you have a sawmill you get rewarded with lumber instead of a rotting pile of debris.
Funny you mention that. It's exactly how I load mine on & off a 6ft x 12ft trailer. I use the cant hook to life the bed high enough to get a jack under it, jack it up high enough to get end of trailer under it, then have a winch on the front of the trailer to crank it on. Once it's on far enough I roll the head forward and then the whole mill tilts up flat and winches straight on back. Not much strain or danger on my part at all. I can do it myself in a few minutes and I much prefer the actual trailer over the goofy little axle that came with the mill.
Funny you mention that. It's exactly how I load mine on & off a 6ft x 12ft trailer. I use the cant hook to life the bed high enough to get a jack under it, jack it up high enough to get end of trailer under it, then have a winch on the front of the trailer to crank it on. Once it's on far enough I roll the head forward and then the whole mill tilts up flat and winches straight on back. Not much strain or danger on my part at all. I can do it myself in a few minutes and I much prefer the actual trailer over the goofy little axle that came with the mill.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Having had 100 acres of oak timber cut, the loggers left huge piles of logs not perfect enough for a professional mill. I hate seeing all those piles of logs lay around.
Yeah loggers take money logs and leave an awful lot of otherwise good stuff to waste. I don't blame them. With the cost of fuel & energy it's hard to justify hauling out smaller or less desirable logs, and it's not economic for mills to hassle with them. Big logs make big fast money and that's what they're after. In terms of having tops & thick stuff lying around, you'll still have plenty for the deer & wildlife. Plucking smaller or less marketable logs from those piles doesn't hurt a thing but sure gives you a pile of good lumber that would otherwise go to waste.
Loggers also leave behind crotches, stumps, burls, hollow logs, and the like. That stuff is where all the most beautiful figure comes from, if you were interested in any wood working or such. Small personal band mills are the easiest way to handle that stuff.Sawmills don't want any of it because it's not uniform in appearance with the straight grain lumber.
BSK
Well-Known Member
I have piles of left-over, imperfect logs that are taller than I am. Many of these piles. We are using some of it for firewood, but just seems like a waste.
And I don't blame the loggers. They have to make a profit, and we made a healthy sum from that as well.
And I don't blame the loggers. They have to make a profit, and we made a healthy sum from that as well.
Yeah some of them are big, but the only place I know that buys cedar is grants Cedar Mill in Gordonsville. I have definitely thought about selling the bigger ones to recoup costs.
I will look into it. I have heard of those types of products but couldn't recall the name. It isn't a large pond, though I may make it a little bigger.
JCDEERMAN
Well-Known Member
We have the same. Not much you can do about it unfortunately. I do wish we had a saw for making boards. If we did, I'd probably have turkey blinds and "atv huts" all over the place to park and conceal a golf cart, etc….for while you're hunting. Having them go to waste sucks, but here in 2-3 years, I'll be burning those newly logged areas and a lot of that should be good nutrients going back into the soil. For the surrounding grasses, forbs, and acorn producing trees.
Man it's a pretty great feeling having every stick of lumber you need and not having to go to hardware store to get it.
