70% there

[Goodtimekiller]

How about a higher jake harvest because there are so many freaking jakes running around from a booming hatch?

Ive seen more jakes this year than i have in 10 years, so has everyone ive talked to.

Not being a debbie downer, but because you, who sees more turkeys than any hunter I know or any hunter on social media, and your few buddies have seen a bumper hatch of jakes in your immediate area, tells us NOTHING biologically about the 2019 statewide hatch covering 95 counties and 27 million acres. Open your eyes, think big picture and realize the STATE is far bigger than your neck of the woods and the primo land you access. For my localized observations in middle and west TN, I have a FEW properties that appear to be better than the last five year average, but there are several other areas I frequent that are struggling bad. These areas were good to great 7-10 years ago, are not close in proximity to chicken litter operations, not prone to spring flooding, and are not hunted all that hard, probably average hunting pressure through the spring season and zero pressure in fall season. We all need to look at the big picture covering 95 counties, that is how STATEWIDE turkey management should be conducted.

For the record, I have hunted and took others hunting the majority of the days season has been open in middle and west TN, have witnessed plenty of success in the woods, and I have yet to see a single jake for certain, either hunting or riding down the road. I've heard a few jake gobbles and I have seen bigger black male birds while driving that were not strutting that could've been jakes, but I have only seen a few of them in my travels. Definitely male birds, but could not tell details with naked the eye at 300 yards and 60 mph. Generally speaking, this year seems to be above average in some of my areas for opportunity, but nothing to write home about. This is my localized observation and means nothing statewide.

As others have mentioned, early spring, record number of license sales, good/great weather across the state, tons of folks off work so in the woods more, and it is no surprise we're at 87% (27,187/31,264) of last year kill total after 14 days of regular season and 2 days of juvenile (36% of season gone by). I am tickled for the apparent bumper hatch in SOME areas last year, and the success we have had this year, but if poult production this summer/fall is no better than the last decade average, I will have serious concerns for the less than primo areas that make up the majority of the state. Sustainable huntable turkey populations and quality hunting throughout the state should be everyone's goal.

It's funny you get so upset about my one, "could it be this positive reason" but all the other negative reasons that are based on no more scientific data than i present are overwhelming accepted. I have hunted all over montgomery county, traveled to lewisberg to cornersville and pulaski through dickson and various other counties and have seen numerous jakes and longbeards everywhere. Makes me wonder if you know what a jake looks like. Do you have a pair of binoculars? They might really help.

To assume the jake harvest numbers are do not mean there are more jakes this year, negates all the negative stuff you guys are posting like, " low harvest means low bird numbers" and "high bird harvests do not mean high bird numbers but thousands more people in the woods."


It's always the negatives on here. If you want to see what a jake looks like come by and i'll show you 20-30.


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[Goodtimekiller]

How about a higher jake harvest because there are so many freaking jakes running around from a booming hatch?

Ive seen more jakes this year than i have in 10 years, so has everyone ive talked to.

Not being a debbie downer, but because you, who sees more turkeys than any hunter I know or any hunter on social media, and your few buddies have seen a bumper hatch of jakes in your immediate area, tells us NOTHING biologically about the 2019 statewide hatch covering 95 counties and 27 million acres. Open your eyes, think big picture and realize the STATE is far bigger than your neck of the woods and the primo land you access. For my localized observations in middle and west TN, I have a FEW properties that appear to be better than the last five year average, but there are several other areas I frequent that are struggling bad. These areas were good to great 7-10 years ago, are not close in proximity to chicken litter operations, not prone to spring flooding, and are not hunted all that hard, probably average hunting pressure through the spring season and zero pressure in fall season. We all need to look at the big picture covering 95 counties, that is how STATEWIDE turkey management should be conducted.

For the record, I have hunted and took others hunting the majority of the days season has been open in middle and west TN, have witnessed plenty of success in the woods, and I have yet to see a single jake for certain, either hunting or riding down the road. I've heard a few jake gobbles and I have seen bigger black male birds while driving that were not strutting that could've been jakes, but I have only seen a few of them in my travels. Definitely male birds, but could not tell details with naked the eye at 300 yards and 60 mph. Generally speaking, this year seems to be above average in some of my areas for opportunity, but nothing to write home about. This is my localized observation and means nothing statewide.

As others have mentioned, early spring, record number of license sales, good/great weather across the state, tons of folks off work so in the woods more, and it is no surprise we're at 87% (27,187/31,264) of last year kill total after 14 days of regular season and 2 days of juvenile (36% of season gone by). I am tickled for the apparent bumper hatch in SOME areas last year, and the success we have had this year, but if poult production this summer/fall is no better than the last decade average, I will have serious concerns for the less than primo areas that make up the majority of the state. Sustainable huntable turkey populations and quality hunting throughout the state should be everyone's goal.

It's funny you get so upset about my one, "could it be this positive reason" but all the other negative reasons that are based on no more scientific data than i present are overwhelming accepted. I have hunted all over montgomery county, traveled to lewisberg to cornersville and pulaski through dickson and various other counties and have seen numerous jakes and longbeards everywhere. Makes me wonder if you know what a jake looks like. Do you have a pair of binoculars? They might really help.

To assume the jake harvest numbers are do not mean there are more jakes this year, negates all the negative stuff you guys are posting like, " low harvest means low bird numbers" and "high bird harvests do not mean high bird numbers but thousands more people in the woods."


It's always the negatives on here. If you want to see what a jake looks like come by and i'll show you 20-30.


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[Andy S.]

Not upset at anyone or about anything, just want others to open their eyes and realize more parts of the state are stagnant or suffering, than are flourishing, especially outside good ole Region 2. That is not negative, just trying to get others to think past their nose and see the big picture. I know what a jake looks like, killed my share of them back in the day when I was a grasshopper, but honestly, a jake means nothing except there was a jake hatched last year that beat the odds, and there is a jake in the immediate area this year. Numerous times I can recall instances where I've hunted farms that had 1-2 old birds and 7-8 jakes thinking next year was going to be unbelievable, only to have 1-2 old birds next year. Jakes are more a nuisance to me than anything when I am hunting as I am not looking to kill a jake ever. I own several pair of binoculars, but they do a man no good if there are no turkeys to look at. No surprise here that you mention Montgomery and Dickson counties. Might as well add Greene, Rutherford and Maury to the mix if you want to discuss your observations for the top producing counties that are useless for management of the statewide turkey population.

 

[bloodtrailing]

How about a higher jake harvest because there are so many freaking jakes running around from a booming hatch?

Ive seen more jakes this year than i have in 10 years, so has everyone ive talked to. Some people here must live depressing lives because NO ONE even glances at a positive option.

We kill fewer birds population must be down and turkey hunting as we know it is coming to an end and we will never have another good harvest. The next year we kill lots of birds and turkey hunting will never rebound, everyone quit hinting right now.

So with the numerous jakes around, it seems like with an early season opener the birds were still able to mate and reproduce successfully.


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We are talking about greater nesting productivity to stabilize the population or increase it.

Imagine what it would be like if you had that number of jakes every year not every 10 years.


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[bloodtrailing]

There are also a lot of predators of turkeys beyond the hunting season. There will be many hens, jakes, gobblers that will not make it.

People think turkeys are like deer. They are very different.


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[Andy S.]

There are also a lot of predators of turkeys beyond the hunting season. There will be many hens, jakes, gobblers that will not make it.

Correct, think outside of hunting season. Some studies suggest 50-75% of turkeys do not see their next birthday. 10 jakes looks good until you understand that the majority will perish before making it to their second birthday.

 

[th88]

There are also a lot of predators of turkeys beyond the hunting season. There will be many hens, jakes, gobblers that will not make it.

Correct, think outside of hunting season. Some studies suggest 50-75% of turkeys do not see their next birthday. 10 jakes looks good until you understand that the majority will perish before making it to their second birthday.

You need to read up on more Turkey literature. Jakes have decent chance to make it to two.

 

[Andy S.]

There are also a lot of predators of turkeys beyond the hunting season. There will be many hens, jakes, gobblers that will not make it.

Correct, think outside of hunting season. Some studies suggest 50-75% of turkeys do not see their next birthday. 10 jakes looks good until you understand that the majority will perish before making it to their second birthday.

You need to read up on more Turkey literature. Jakes have decent chance to make it to two.

I've read plenty of academic research, many times peer reviewed, define decent.

 

[Goodtimekiller]

How about a higher jake harvest because there are so many freaking jakes running around from a booming hatch?

Ive seen more jakes this year than i have in 10 years, so has everyone ive talked to. Some people here must live depressing lives because NO ONE even glances at a positive option.

We kill fewer birds population must be down and turkey hunting as we know it is coming to an end and we will never have another good harvest. The next year we kill lots of birds and turkey hunting will never rebound, everyone quit hinting right now.

So with the numerous jakes around, it seems like with an early season opener the birds were still able to mate and reproduce successfully.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We are talking about greater nesting productivity to stabilize the population or increase it.

Imagine what it would be like if you had that number of jakes every year not every 10 years.


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What i am talking about is greater nesting productivity happened because everyone i have talked to (except the old timers on tn deer) has seen huge numbers of jakes. My only comment was "could the increased jake harvest be because there are more jakes this year?" Seems just as logical as any other comment i've read.

Maybe for those folks who have so many fewer turkeys, you should have managed your turkeys like a finite resource instead of like an unlimited supply. I have seen many people on here preaching gloom and doom but theyre still killing turkeys. If i believed like most people on here, i would have quit hunting turkeys in tn long ago.


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[megalomaniac]

Twra says shooting 4 toms before nesting has started is just fine. They are the experts.

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[Andy S.]

How about a higher jake harvest because there are so many freaking jakes running around from a booming hatch?

Ive seen more jakes this year than i have in 10 years, so has everyone ive talked to. Some people here must live depressing lives because NO ONE even glances at a positive option.

We kill fewer birds population must be down and turkey hunting as we know it is coming to an end and we will never have another good harvest. The next year we kill lots of birds and turkey hunting will never rebound, everyone quit hinting right now.

So with the numerous jakes around, it seems like with an early season opener the birds were still able to mate and reproduce successfully.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We are talking about greater nesting productivity to stabilize the population or increase it.

Imagine what it would be like if you had that number of jakes every year not every 10 years.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What i am talking about is greater nesting productivity happened because everyone i have talked to (except the old timers on tn deer) has seen huge numbers of jakes. My only comment was "could the increased jake harvest be because there are more jakes this year?" Seems just as logical as any other comment i've read.

Maybe for those folks who have so many fewer turkeys, you should have managed your turkeys like a finite resource instead of like an unlimited supply. I have seen many people on here preaching gloom and doom but theyre still killing turkeys. If i believed like most people on here, i would have quit hunting turkeys in tn long ago.

Please advise on how an individual should manage a resource on land that he/she does not own and a resource that none of us individually own. A handful of hunters killing two instead of three or four makes no discernible difference on a statewide resource. Again, think big picture, think of all the factors that plague a turkey's survival 24/7/365.

 

[Andy S.]

Twra says shooting 4 toms before nesting has started is just fine. They are the experts.

:stir: I am inclined to think TFWC is more deserving of this criticism than TWRA. I hope TWRA gives Roger Shields and his team(s) time to make a difference and they actually listen to the research and his recommendations, and furthermore listen to the hunters from select areas of the State that are struggling.

 

[megalomaniac]

As an aside, I have a pretty good feel after 8 entire days afield in TN. We clearly have fewer adult Toms than we've had in a long while on my farms. But the flip side is we actually have more jakes than we've had in a long while. Next year should be a decent uptick in 2 yos to hunt. And most importantly, more jakes means more jennies out there, which means even more reproductive capacity and the potential for flock expansion.

According to TWRA, last years hatch was terrible statewide, but I feel very fortunate to have had a great local hatch on 4 out of 5 of my farms.

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[Andy S.]

And most importantly, more jakes means more jennies out there, which means even more reproductive capacity and the potential for flock expansion.

I hope and pray this is the case for majority of the state. Many hunters hate dealing with hens in the spring, but battling with them first few weeks of season is always a good sign for future flock expansion potential, which is far more important than an easy hunt without hens in the picture.

 

[bloodtrailing]

How about a higher jake harvest because there are so many freaking jakes running around from a booming hatch?

Ive seen more jakes this year than i have in 10 years, so has everyone ive talked to. Some people here must live depressing lives because NO ONE even glances at a positive option.

We kill fewer birds population must be down and turkey hunting as we know it is coming to an end and we will never have another good harvest. The next year we kill lots of birds and turkey hunting will never rebound, everyone quit hinting right now.

So with the numerous jakes around, it seems like with an early season opener the birds were still able to mate and reproduce successfully.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We are talking about greater nesting productivity to stabilize the population or increase it.

Imagine what it would be like if you had that number of jakes every year not every 10 years.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What i am talking about is greater nesting productivity happened because everyone i have talked to (except the old timers on tn deer) has seen huge numbers of jakes. My only comment was "could the increased jake harvest be because there are more jakes this year?" Seems just as logical as any other comment i've read.

Maybe for those folks who have so many fewer turkeys, you should have managed your turkeys like a finite resource instead of like an unlimited supply. I have seen many people on here preaching gloom and doom but theyre still killing turkeys. If i believed like most people on here, i would have quit hunting turkeys in tn long ago.


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I cannot control the full range of a spring time turkey. I have controlled what I have access to.


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[Goodtimekiller]

How about a higher jake harvest because there are so many freaking jakes running around from a booming hatch?

Ive seen more jakes this year than i have in 10 years, so has everyone ive talked to. Some people here must live depressing lives because NO ONE even glances at a positive option.

We kill fewer birds population must be down and turkey hunting as we know it is coming to an end and we will never have another good harvest. The next year we kill lots of birds and turkey hunting will never rebound, everyone quit hinting right now.

So with the numerous jakes around, it seems like with an early season opener the birds were still able to mate and reproduce successfully.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We are talking about greater nesting productivity to stabilize the population or increase it.

Imagine what it would be like if you had that number of jakes every year not every 10 years.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What i am talking about is greater nesting productivity happened because everyone i have talked to (except the old timers on tn deer) has seen huge numbers of jakes. My only comment was "could the increased jake harvest be because there are more jakes this year?" Seems just as logical as any other comment i've read.

Maybe for those folks who have so many fewer turkeys, you should have managed your turkeys like a finite resource instead of like an unlimited supply. I have seen many people on here preaching gloom and doom but theyre still killing turkeys. If i believed like most people on here, i would have quit hunting turkeys in tn long ago.

Please advise on how an individual should manage a resource on land that he/she does not own and a resource that none of us individually own. A handful of hunters killing two instead of three or four makes no discernible difference on a statewide resource. Again, think big picture, think of all the factors that plague a turkey's survival 24/7/365.

The big picture starts with individuals. Have you been to twrc meetings, have you taken friend to those meetings, have you been predator trapping, have you tried developing habitat on the farms you hunt, have you voluntarily refrained yourself from hunting birds. Not because you are killing toms but by hunting you are potentially knocking hens off their nests, disrupting birds breeding and causing overall stress in the flock. It is really easy to sit back and blame someone because they have not made the changes you want but it is much harder to be the change. Set the example, other than getting on a forum and being negative and criticizing everyone else, that doesnt help anyone.


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[AT Hiker]

Whether you think the turkeys are on the brink of extinction, over carrying capacity or somewhere in between. Doesn't matter, we are slaying them this year.

As of today we are at 29,000 kills.


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[poorhunter]

Wonder what the numbers are for other states?

 

[2in1shot]

Kentucky killed 29,500 last year and 27,200 in 2018

So far they are at 12,500

 

[AT Hiker]

Kentucky killed 29,500 last year and 27,200 in 2018

So far they are at 12,500

Main season opened Sat. Wonder how the weekend openers have compared?


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