Setterman
Well-Known Member
WRbowhunter":1kbrpiyt said:
I feel the same, my biggest concern is having as many turkeys as possible. A bunch of us remember when we had none to very few, and see this sport as more then just as a chance to kill birds
A vote for a change in season structure
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I feel the same, my biggest concern is having as many turkeys as possible. A bunch of us remember when we had none to very few, and see this sport as more then just as a chance to kill birds
[/quoteWRbowhunter":3hv7kg7h said:
Its the information used to form that opinion that matters. Go tell the guys in the Southern counties they have plenty of birds to hunt and see what their opinion is.
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WRbowhunter
Well-Known Member
But why is the response always to reduce the limit and everyone should Hunt the way I hunt. that's my biggest issue with all this. Personally I have no clue why we have a fall turkey season and especially allow hens to be killed. But I don't hunt turkeys in the fall so its easy for me to question the practice. I just trust the folks at TWRA to manage our wildlife more than a few people on TNDEER who have a certain agenda and want to try to keep trying to slam it down our throats.
Setterman
Well-Known Member
WRbowhunter":1p7nm6wp said:
I have no agenda other then maximizing the population, and having the best turkey hunting in the country available here. I do not feel the regulations are conducive for that goal.
I'm also tired of whiners claiming those of us who want to improve the hunting are talking down to those who's only concern is killing as many as they can and as fast as possible be damned everything else
WRbowhunter
Well-Known Member
"I'm also tired of whiners claiming those of us who want to improve the hunting are talking down to those who's only concern is killing as many as they can and as fast as possible be damned everything else"
And who is that? I don't know the Turkey numbers so hopefully someone will share. How many kill the limit? Most likely the same ones pushing for the reduced limit. The same goes with deer. And I have no doubt you believe what your pushing will improve hunting. I just happen to disagree. If there is a problem with the Deer or turkey population I am all for doing what needs to be done. I just happen to believe that at this point it has not been proven there is a problem with the health of turkeys and Deer. then it goes back to Everyone should hunt the way I hunt and should only be satisfied with the caliber of animal that I am satisfied with. Hunt the way you want to hunt and I will hunt the way I want to hunt. What do you care if I kill a jake. If I am happy with it then you should be happy for me too. but if you don't want to kill a jake then that's up to you and I certainly understand why you don't .
And who is that? I don't know the Turkey numbers so hopefully someone will share. How many kill the limit? Most likely the same ones pushing for the reduced limit. The same goes with deer. And I have no doubt you believe what your pushing will improve hunting. I just happen to disagree. If there is a problem with the Deer or turkey population I am all for doing what needs to be done. I just happen to believe that at this point it has not been proven there is a problem with the health of turkeys and Deer. then it goes back to Everyone should hunt the way I hunt and should only be satisfied with the caliber of animal that I am satisfied with. Hunt the way you want to hunt and I will hunt the way I want to hunt. What do you care if I kill a jake. If I am happy with it then you should be happy for me too. but if you don't want to kill a jake then that's up to you and I certainly understand why you don't .
woodsman87
Well-Known Member
Nobody is shoving anything down anybody else's throat. All of the guys that know what they are talking about are also the guys that try to make the sport better. All of us that know what is going on are trying to educate others about the importance of turkey habitat and preserving as many hens and young turkeys as possible.
Don't bring deer into this, deer and turkeys cannot be managed the same. It is also some of the deer hunting ways that is changing the sport. Everyone just wants to sit in a blind in a chufa patch and see if one will come to within 70 yards so they can shoot it with their super nitro shells
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Don't bring deer into this, deer and turkeys cannot be managed the same. It is also some of the deer hunting ways that is changing the sport. Everyone just wants to sit in a blind in a chufa patch and see if one will come to within 70 yards so they can shoot it with their super nitro shells
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Setterman
Well-Known Member
What you don't seem to understand is that every jake that gets killed near or on the places I hunt affects the numbers of gobbling birds the following year. Every hen that gets killed affects the numbers of birds the following year.
It's really simple. The crux of turkey hunting is hunting gobbling birds, killing jakes goes totally against that principle.
you keep wanting to make this about "my way of hunting", but show me one turkey Hunter, that doesn't want each trip to the woods to be filled with gobbling birds.
Also, it doesn't matter how many kill all 4 birds, it cheapens a tag to the point where who cares if you shoot a jake or two, you've still got plenty of tags. How many hunters get to three, continue killing saving that last tag?
Stop talking about deer. They have no relevance in a turkey discussion
It's really simple. The crux of turkey hunting is hunting gobbling birds, killing jakes goes totally against that principle.
you keep wanting to make this about "my way of hunting", but show me one turkey Hunter, that doesn't want each trip to the woods to be filled with gobbling birds.
Also, it doesn't matter how many kill all 4 birds, it cheapens a tag to the point where who cares if you shoot a jake or two, you've still got plenty of tags. How many hunters get to three, continue killing saving that last tag?
Stop talking about deer. They have no relevance in a turkey discussion
I don't wanna get in on this argument because I don't know near as much about turkeys as most guys on here but here's my question, if a lot more people got into trapping, wouldn't that be a very positive impact on nests? Even if it was just for coons, opossums, skunks? I got into it this year and caught 6 coons and 1 opossum. Catching the big predators are more difficult, I haven't figured it out anyway.
Another question, how many birds actually get ate by coyotes, fox, and bobcat after they are able to fly? Just somethin I've always wondered
Another question, how many birds actually get ate by coyotes, fox, and bobcat after they are able to fly? Just somethin I've always wondered
Setterman
Well-Known Member
Widespread trapping would be hugely beneficial, as would predator hunting to a point. You need some predation to weed out the injured, sick, weak members of the population.bobo84":2z7to0zi said:
Some get eaten by predators, but I personally don't feel it's a tremendous number once the birds have matured
TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
I believe the number of grown birds being caught by the larger predators is increasing.bobo84":4e5z3483 said:
I say this for several reasons, all of which are observations by me and friends, including:
1) Seeing more and more daylight hunting by bobcats and coyotes, where they are specifically targeting turkeys.
2) Seeing more and more evidence of kills, typically lots of feathers in a food plot.
3) Most unexpected, seeing bald eagles specifically hunting for turkeys.
My belief is that these predators are simply adapting over time, becoming more proficient at hunting turkeys, as same can be said for us human hunters.
While I'm seeing this year round, in the spring strutting gobblers are particularly vulnerable, and I'm even wondering if they are evolving to become less vocal, since their gobbles attract such a variety of predators. Of course, nesting hens can be particularly vulnerable to coyotes as well.
AllOutdoors
Well-Known Member
I enjoy turkey hunting and have killed many longbeards. A few with multiple beards and called many in for others. I even guided a few from out of state and all but one limited out. If he hadn't missed, he would have limited. I've never killed a Jake or hen
I don't claim to be a turkey god but have noticed a decline in population. So when those that eat, sleep turkey hunting with more experience than me speak, i tend to listen. Even if it is changing dates, bag limits, beard lengths etc. I can see that I don't think they care what you shoot! They only want what is best for the turkey population So we can all enjoy the hunt on a more regular basis.
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I don't claim to be a turkey god but have noticed a decline in population. So when those that eat, sleep turkey hunting with more experience than me speak, i tend to listen. Even if it is changing dates, bag limits, beard lengths etc. I can see that I don't think they care what you shoot! They only want what is best for the turkey population So we can all enjoy the hunt on a more regular basis.
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deerchaser007
Well-Known Member
I agree with Wes, red tail hawks are another that is a huge problem, especially to our poults and younger birds. But even larger birds. I shot a gobbler 2 year ago and had to run a red tail hawk off of it 5 seconds after I shot. Listen guys, for those that still have it good you don't understand. Its natural for toms to gobble and the hens go to them. If they are not gobbling due to extreme pressure, then something is wrong! Reduce pressure so the turkey can do what's natural. If shutting it off at noon helps, so be it. Reduce limits, so be it. I have no desire to hunt turkey like I hunt deer. Just not fun!
letsgohunting
Well-Known Member
No hen kill in the fall or spring and you have 4 tags (male) total to use for spring and fall.
Living in a county that borders the state line I see a steady flow of Alabama tags in the mornings and I feel that's why deer and Turkey season limits haven't changed. That big non resident money to the state
Living in a county that borders the state line I see a steady flow of Alabama tags in the mornings and I feel that's why deer and Turkey season limits haven't changed. That big non resident money to the state
FARMTOFIELD
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Setterman":3gg8dajk said:
They are harder on nests than grown birds for sure, when you have 50 hens and 25% of their nests get busTed it's not huge, but when you have 15 hens and 25% get busted it is huge, I'd that makes since.
The BIGGEST problem is, everyone wants to change, everyone wants to help, everyone wants a solution, everyone wants to do their part..... until closing day, and then 99% don't think about it anymore until a year later.
That's very interesting about the predators. I just assumed since their vision was so good that it wouldn't be a big deal, esp multiple birds together. I can see where a bird strutting would be an easier target or a nesting hen.
callemquacktn
Well-Known Member
Turkeys start breeding a lot earlier than yall think. 3 yrs ago we had a couple hens with poults hatched the last week of april.
We'll see how much depredation helps, last year on my farm in lawrence, me and my buddy killed over 80 armadillos, between trapping and coon hunting with dogs we killed over 40 coons, we killed 12 skunks, we killed a couple of coyotes during deer season, I haven't even seen an armadillo this year, and I don't have near the coons on my trail cameras that I used to have. I'm gonna continue to kill every armadillo I see and every other legal nest raider I come across. This has to help some what.
Mike Belt
Well-Known Member
Setterman... Quick question...I've seen you mention that killing jakes reduces potential gobblers the following season. Doesn't killing ANY gobblers reduce that same potential? What is the difference in killing a couple of 2 year old birds plus a couple of jakes, 4 adult birds, or just killing all jakes? Personally I don't shoot them because they're just too gullible and sometimes it seems like no contest.
I think there's a combination of reasons for a turkey decline. Predation is prime; both 4 legged and winged but the destruction of nests and eggs is the leader. With less trapping most predators are left to their own demise. Also raptor numbers are on the rise everywhere and they are protected. Dependent upon location (flood plain), weather could also factor in. You may not like linking deer to turkeys but management of their populations is identical in that you manage the female portion to manage the population. If overall numbers are low, lay off killing the hens. Another like aspect is that for better management results there needs to be micro management. Blanket regulation doesn't improve failing areas and may possibly make matters worse.
Why the birds seem to be less vocal this year is anyone's guess. There's always the assumption of them being henned up. If their numbers are down it stands to reason less gobbling will be heard. Many times a gobbler will respond to another bird gobbling. If there are fewer of them doing so it may add to that silent factor.
I think there's a combination of reasons for a turkey decline. Predation is prime; both 4 legged and winged but the destruction of nests and eggs is the leader. With less trapping most predators are left to their own demise. Also raptor numbers are on the rise everywhere and they are protected. Dependent upon location (flood plain), weather could also factor in. You may not like linking deer to turkeys but management of their populations is identical in that you manage the female portion to manage the population. If overall numbers are low, lay off killing the hens. Another like aspect is that for better management results there needs to be micro management. Blanket regulation doesn't improve failing areas and may possibly make matters worse.
Why the birds seem to be less vocal this year is anyone's guess. There's always the assumption of them being henned up. If their numbers are down it stands to reason less gobbling will be heard. Many times a gobbler will respond to another bird gobbling. If there are fewer of them doing so it may add to that silent factor.
