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Baiting Bill HB1618/SB1942

Should baiting be allowed on private land?

  • Yes

    Votes: 181 39.5%

  • No

    Votes: 204 44.5%

  • Don't care

    Votes: 73 15.9%
  • Total voters
    458
Maybe it would work towards limiting the idea that hunting over bait is actually "hunting" by having everyone (including national hunting magazines, hunting organizations, deer hunting YouTube bloggers, "famous deer hunters", etc.) to always be asked when they talk about killing a deer - "Did you hunt using bait?" and if they respond YES, say to them "That's not hunting. That's fishing for deer. Why did you need to make it easy to kill the deer?" That might change a lot of attitudes over time.

But baiting is firmly entrenched (with some people) as a means of "fair chase" and changing that will be an uphill battle when both Pope and Young and Boone and Crocket defer to the rules of local state wildlife management agencies:

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So it's OK to shoot deer by sitting by a planted corn field and shoot deer that walk into it. Personally, I've never seen a corncob chasing a deer around a field. It's usually the other way around. And the hunters sitting on their butts in front of a pile of corn aren't chasing anything.
 
BigJohnJTP said:
Maybe it would work towards limiting the idea that hunting over bait is actually "hunting" by having everyone (including national hunting magazines, hunting organizations, deer hunting YouTube bloggers, "famous deer hunters", etc.) to always be asked when they talk about killing a deer - "Did you hunt using bait?" and if they respond YES, say to them "That's not hunting. That's fishing for deer. Why did you need to make it easy to kill the deer?" That might change a lot of attitudes over time.

But baiting is firmly entrenched (with some people) as a means of "fair chase" and changing that will be an uphill battle when both Pope and Young and Boone and Crocket defer to the rules of local state wildlife management agencies:

View attachment 239581

So it's OK to shoot deer by sitting by a planted corn field and shoot deer that walk into it. Personally, I've never seen a corncob chasing a deer around a field. It's usually the other way around. And the hunters sitting on their butts in front of a pile of corn aren't chasing anything.
Click to expand...
I seen 5 ears of corn chasing 2 bucks this morning. Dame ears of corn stood about 4 feet high with long blonde hair and mustaches. Tried to get a picture but they were just too fast.
 
Don't know why everyone is worried about it cause alot have said that mature bucks won't come to a bait pile !!! Seen some big ole bucks on videos killed on bait piles ...I must be missing something . Is this real hunting ? As much as setting in a shooting house watching a food plot ? Neither IMO is real hunting....or is hunting from a permanent stands ???? Come on not many of us hunt like those before us . We hunt the same places we own or lease and pretty much know which areas to hunt with the desired wind ...or in other words we are lazier than our forefathers that hunted ...or are we smarter ??🤣🤣🤣 Please let's let this thread die brothers ...PLEASE 😭😭
 
Boone and Crockett doesn't care how you became legal owner of your antlers. They only care if the antlers were legally obtained. Even if it was found, or picked up in a yard sale. LEGALLY. by State and local standards. They do not write these laws, they want the law followed.

The only reason the questions are asked is so that the antlers may be categorized after deemed legal.

But as to baiting. I am not a fan. It is unnatural. I believe that deer, like dogs, can be conditioned, on some property, to be comfortable around bait sites. If given enough opportunity to visit the site from a young age, with no negative association, then I've seen them come to bait quite relaxed.

But never older aged class deer in high pressure situations.
 
Dr. Leonard Lee Rue III in his 2001 book The Deer Hunter's Illustrated Dictionary agrees with you:

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However, I can tell you from personal experience over the years doing a few 1/4 acre food plots there is far more work to them than throwing out some corn. And the deer will often ignore your corn and your food plot if there is a natural field with forbs and some clover close to a hardwood forest near by.
 
FLTENNHUNTER1 said:
Haven't read 52 pages but food plots are baiting deer. If it wasn't, why do it?
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It gives guys that warm fuzzy feeling that they can bait deer legally. All the while proclaiming its not baiting. I don't care either way, I'd rather hunt the sign and use funnels and pinch points. To each thier own.
 
FLTENNHUNTER1 said:
Haven't read 52 pages but food plots are baiting deer. If it wasn't, why do it?
Click to expand...

I've got several food plots and nobody including myself hunt anywhere near them. If I let you on my property and find out you hunted one of my plots you'll never hunt there again. My plots aren't bait. Food plots = corn piles is not an accurate parallel to make.
 
BigJohnJTP said:
Dr. Leonard Lee Rue III in his 2001 book The Deer Hunter's Illustrated Dictionary agrees with you:

View attachment 239744

However, I can tell you from personal experience over the years doing a few 1/4 acre food plots there is far more work to them than throwing out some corn.
Click to expand...

I will argue Dr. Rue doesn't agree with the idea that a corn-pile is even closely equivalent to a 1/4-acre or larger food plot or field. Note his use of one "might" view hunting a field as a type of "baiting".
He then just asks the question, as a point to ponder, "Is hunting over a placed bait any different from hunting over a planted farm crop?"

The answer is "No".
It's just that many proponents of shooting game over bait piles attempt to justify it by saying "it's the same" as shooting game over a field.
 
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I agree with timberjack 86. " I don't care either way, I'd rather hunt the sign and use funnels and pinch points. To each thier own." The best hunters I have known always pay attention to the terrain but really only hunt active sign. Scrapes, rubs, tracks, etc. If there's no recent sign that deer have been there why hunt there?
 
The following words are just my opinion after decades of hunting.

Hunting deer: Hunting public land. Walking into the South Cherokee WMA and competing with unknown numbers of hunters in unknown locations in very rugged conditions. Walking into the Green Swamp WMA in Florida and competing with unknown numbers of hunters in unknown locations, with other creatures who can hunt and kill you. I have done both with extremely limited success. You are lucky to even see a deer for days at a time. Killed my first buck after 10 years of hunting the Green Swamp. Hunted mostly with archery equipment.

Shooting deer: Owning private property where you control the access of other hunters, i.e., control hunting pressure, use food plots or other means to entice or lure deer onto your property, shoot and kill deer from blinds, stands, etc. in known deer locations.

Baiting - Products used to entice or lure deer to your location.
Food plots - crops used to entice or lure deer to your location.

The key words are entice or lure.

Sure, throwing out corn or using a deer feeder is easier than planting food plots, but the goal is ultimately the same. To entice or lure deer to your location. Both are what I call deer shooting vs. deer hunting.
 
The least intrusive and pretty common sense recommendation to me was by someone who said (maybe on this discussion thread?) it would seem best if game management agencies simply calculated the numbers and kinds of game that needed to be harvested to reduce or maintain wildlife (based on their game population research they PUBLISHED) and then awarded a number of tags to each individual and let people harvest the game the way they preferred - bow, gun, muzzleloader, buck, doe. Let them decide their own definition of fair chase for themselves and their families. And stopped trying to tell people how to hunt. Deer are generally overpopulated. If the right number of deer are harvested in an area, what difference does it make exactly how they are harvested?
 
FLTENNHUNTER1 said:
The following words are just my opinion after decades of hunting.

Hunting deer: Hunting public land. Walking into the South Cherokee WMA and competing with unknown numbers of hunters in unknown locations in very rugged conditions. Walking into the Green Swamp WMA in Florida and competing with unknown numbers of hunters in unknown locations, with other creatures who can hunt and kill you. I have done both with extremely limited success. You are lucky to even see a deer for days at a time. Killed my first buck after 10 years of hunting the Green Swamp. Hunted mostly with archery equipment.

Shooting deer: Owning private property where you control the access of other hunters, i.e., control hunting pressure, use food plots or other means to entice or lure deer onto your property, shoot and kill deer from blinds, stands, etc. in known deer locations.

Baiting - Products used to entice or lure deer to your location.
Food plots - crops used to entice or lure deer to your location.

The key words are entice or lure.

Sure, throwing out corn or using a deer feeder is easier than planting food plots, but the goal is ultimately the same. To entice or lure deer to your location. Both are what I call deer shooting vs. deer hunting.
Click to expand...

Well Excuse Me GIF by StarTalk Radio with Neil deGrasse Tyson
 
FLTENNHUNTER1 said:
The following words are just my opinion after decades of hunting.

Hunting deer: Hunting public land. Walking into the South Cherokee WMA and competing with unknown numbers of hunters in unknown locations in very rugged conditions. Walking into the Green Swamp WMA in Florida and competing with unknown numbers of hunters in unknown locations, with other creatures who can hunt and kill you. I have done both with extremely limited success. You are lucky to even see a deer for days at a time. Killed my first buck after 10 years of hunting the Green Swamp. Hunted mostly with archery equipment.

Shooting deer: Owning private property where you control the access of other hunters, i.e., control hunting pressure, use food plots or other means to entice or lure deer onto your property, shoot and kill deer from blinds, stands, etc. in known deer locations.

Baiting - Products used to entice or lure deer to your location.
Food plots - crops used to entice or lure deer to your location.

The key words are entice or lure.

Sure, throwing out corn or using a deer feeder is easier than planting food plots, but the goal is ultimately the same. To entice or lure deer to your location. Both are what I call deer shooting vs. deer hunting.
Click to expand...
Morgan Freeman Reaction GIF by MOODMAN
 
BigJohnJTP said:
If the right number of deer are harvested in an area, what difference does it make exactly how they are harvested?
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There are many at the top of the Dept of the Interior, right now, who would agree with you. Their most ideal solution is to just entirely outlaw "sport" hunting, and leave the necessary killing to government contracted "sharpshooters".

The ethics aspect of "sport" hunting, which is for the most part what most of us are claiming we do, does matter.

But I will agree with you that the lines are blurred, and non-hunters in particular are challenged to understand both the desire of hunting or the presumed ethics of the hunters. Most of the voting citizenry is now composed of non-hunters, and at least half of them would like nothing better than for the government to take care of this presumed problem of too many deer.

So how do we encourage more people to get into ethical sport hunting, as opposed to simply killing the deer presumed need killing?

I don't have all the answers.
I just know there's a difference between shooting and hunting.
 
I provided some information (from experts) earlier that said pretty much that baiting was not that different from food plots. Just to show you all I/We should look at all sides of this issue, here is a very good article against baiting by the National Deer Association that may "ring your chimes" if you are very much against it. "Can Baiting and Feeding Really Spread Deer Diseases Faster?"

deerassociation.com

Can Baiting and Feeding Really Spread Deer Diseases Faster?

Some say baiting and feeding deer can help increase the spread of deer diseases. Here's a look at the scientific evidence.
deerassociation.com deerassociation.com

But notice in the middle of the article "The NDA opposes the expansion of baiting where it is not currently legal. The NDA will not work to repeal baiting where it is currently legal, except where CWD or another known disease is present."

So I guess they are saying in summary "So were against it and think its a bad idea but we are not going to try to really change anything." What? OMG.

Looks like there won't be a solution that makes everyone happy any time soon. Oh well. I've got to take grandkids to school by getting up around 5 am tomorrow so it's time for me to ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ. Over and out.
 

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